NSOC vote

[Rude Dog]

Originally Posted by airbox

I don't care if it is part of another site or not, I very rarely venture off this bit.

Therein lies part of the problem. The forum mods/admin aren't allowing us to keep our for sale and part wanted threads, etc, in here and the majority of us Stagea owners stay in this bit like you and miss out on stuff which is part of the problem. Theres also a lot of bad feeling because of a recently not allowed Stagea only group buy. But thats another thread....

[Red_08]

Originally Posted by airbox

I thought NSOC stood for nissan sx owners club or am I wrong.

Correct, you are wrong.

SXOC is the SX Owners Club, I was a member up until last month to be honest.
The forums there are great, but not without the same problems that beset forums everywhere. Human nature means we have clashing personalities and differences of opinion.
Let's hope this whole issue is resolved and we can start "proper" with the Stagea domination.

[airbox]

so what does NSOC stand for then?

[oldskoolturbo]

Originally Posted by airbox

so what does NSOC stand for then?

Nissan Stagea Owners Club

[airbox]

I thought most of the stagea owners on here were members of that. Not sure where the problem is but then I have never been good at politics!!

[hesh]

I only have one question that i need to answer with regard to my use of any club and or forum.

Do i get any thing worthwhile out of it?

in terms of searching for stagea info, the GTRoc Stagea section has been up for ages. ive used it rarely, due to the volume of skyline specific stuff.

the newly created forum has already been of use to me, in repsect of its easier access to information. (though some of that is in the form of links back here)

so ...the answers obvious. the stageas should in my opinion have their own forum as distinct from any other Nissan or skyline variant.

as for AGM's.....last thing i personally want to do is sit in a meeting voting on due process and official this and that when I'm off work. i get more than a belly full of officialdom whilst i AM actually at work.

politics as i understand it is the art of saying much, promising little and delivering less, whilst all the time appearing frantically busy and/or important.

I'd rather be under the car on a sunny Sunday with a can of stone chip or some anti rust primer. much more satisfying, with a more tangible result.

[seastate]

Originally Posted by hesh

I only have one question that i need to answer with regard to my use of any club and or forum.

Do i get any thing worthwhile out of it?

in terms of searching for stagea info, the GTRoc Stagea section has been up for ages. ive used it rarely, due to the volume of skyline specific stuff.

the newly created forum has already been of use to me, in repsect of its easier access to information. (though some of that is in the form of links back here)

so ...the answers obvious. the stageas should in my opinion have their own forum as distinct from any other Nissan or skyline variant.

as for AGM's.....last thing i personally want to do is sit in a meeting voting on due process and official this and that when I'm off work. i get more than a belly full of officialdom whilst i AM actually at work.

politics as i understand it is the art of saying much, promising little and delivering less, whilst all the time appearing frantically busy and/or important.

I'd rather be under the car on a sunny Sunday with a can of stone chip or some anti rust primer. much more satisfying, with a more tangible result.

The AGM is a few beers once a year to discuss anything that might be worth discussing. Hardly an unbearable burden, and there's nothing saying everyone has to go.

If all you want is info to keep your car on the road, you have it. If you want to get together with like minded people sometimes and try to develop a club that will help everyone then you can join the Stagea Club if you want.

[hesh]

Originally Posted by seastate

The AGM is a few beers once a year to discuss anything that might be worth discussing. Hardly an unbearable burden, and there's nothing saying everyone has to go.

If all you want is info to keep your car on the road, you have it. If you want to get together with like minded people sometimes and try to develop a club that will help everyone then you can join the Stagea Club if you want.

fair enough about the AGM, ive never been. There has been a number of less than complimentary comments about AGMs in several threads though!

Yes i admit the info is here. but to use the same argument as i did over on SO.com regarding the NA skyline specific stuff. It is buried in amongst the wealth of info for the turbo, or in this case skyline variants. The solution for the NA was to creat a section for NA owners. that works well over there because its the same car...the stagea isn't. its a different car that shares some parts.

Following that logic you could just as easily have the NA skyline on a 200sx forum on the basis as we share most of our brake components with them. People new to the stagea may not initially know of its links to the skyline, therefore there's no reason to assume they would search google for initial info on it via a different cars forum. having said that, a section here makes sense for owners aware of the links, if looking for parts like g sensors and or wiring diagrams ect.

information is only usefull if its easily accessable, and by default having our own stagea specific forum would increase this ease of accessability.

So in essence i guess what i'd propose to be the optimum solution would be to have a standalone forum ala the nissan-stagea.org. AND the section here. the section on GTRoc would then be preforming a different function, and perhaps could reside in the technical forums. (i am unaware of exactly what restrictions members and non members of tgroc have as regards access to these)

this solves the issues of group buys, as these would migrate to the other forum, as would any social stuff in all likelihood. leaving the technical side here for the obvious benefits of the wealth of experience with tuning the rb series and shared components.

The club side of things often grows out of all of the above. if you buy a new "hobby" car, you want to find info about it. which means asking questions of owners, which often means meeting up, (indeed pre internet it certianly did..meets were the primary way of sorting and exchanging info) and "e voila" a bunch of likeminded people with a common interest.....

everything stems from the information ...finding it and sharing it ...and from that a "club" is formed.

[Rude Dog]

If people really wanted to be pedantic we should really be affiliated with the Nissan C34 Laurel owners club as that what our cars are based upon, not Skylines!

In the UK however the Laurel is virtually unknown so because we have Skyline engines and running gear we get lumped in with them. You're all driving Laurel Estates, not Skyline Estates LOL.

[Fuggles]

As an ex-Stagea owner and a member of the NSOC and one of the people who attended the Innaugural General Meeting of the club (and acted as Secretary for the IGM) I would like to suggest that any vote should be to PAID MEMBERS only. Anyone else who has not contributed to the club financially clearly doesn't support the club and is happy to 'freeload' so should have no voting rights. Any vote should either be done by email or PM to the paid members, why is there a need for anonymity? The website Stagea.co.uk has been long establioshed by the NSOC as it's main information site and source and should be the place for the forum not some other site with an overly complex name.

As Chairman of the GTROC I am happy to say we as a club are pleased to have been involved in bringing together all Stagea enthusiasts and helping form the NSOC. However, we recognise the NSOC is it's own independent club and will support whatever decision is made by the NSOC membership

[jimbo54]

As a Stagea OWNER and an unpaid non member and freeloader may l sugest that any forum member may vote

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Fuggles

As an ex-Stagea owner and a member of the NSOC and one of the people who attended the Innaugural General Meeting of the club (and acted as Secretary for the IGM) I would like to suggest that any vote should be to PAID MEMBERS only. Anyone else who has not contributed to the club financially clearly doesn't support the club and is happy to 'freeload' so should have no voting rights. Any vote should either be done by email or PM to the paid members, why is there a need for anonymity? The website Stagea.co.uk has been long establioshed by the NSOC as it's main information site and source and should be the place for the forum not some other site with an overly complex name.

As Chairman of the GTROC I am happy to say we as a club are pleased to have been involved in bringing together all Stagea enthusiasts and helping form the NSOC. However, we recognise the NSOC is it's own independent club and will support whatever decision is made by the NSOC membership

EX-stagea owner been the operative word, i think this goes beyond the NSOC and i's short comings, there are stagea owners who dont want to join the club because of problems with members of the comitee so should their voice not be heard? i dont think just because the dont pay there £10 for a few stickers and membership card that it means their freeloading, the vote should be out in the open because theres already been too much "behind the scenes" between the nsoc and the gtroc, stagea.co.uk has been around for a while but it has been updated marks car is still for sale on there even though at the igm we were told an updates site was on it's way. plus the chairman did say that stagea.co.uk was his to do with as he pleases, shouldnt it be for the members by the members? i didnt think nissan-stagea.org was over complicated when i created it. it's a nissan, it's a stagea it an organisation. how is it complicated? and all this started over comments made by gtroc members you've even got them in this thread, they dont own a stagea so why post comments about what the stage acommunity should do. and actually the r33 is based the the same laurel platform so how skyline owners have the cheek to look down on us is beyond belief, i own r32 and a r33 but i still get shuned at shows and meets, they only place i've been welcomed as an equel was at the cleethorpes show on the skyline-owners-club stand how were very nice people and the stageas were part of the stand not shoved of to one side. stagea.org was created to re/palce the nsoc ro to compete with the various skyline forums but just to be a place for stagea owners were we dont have to be policed, were we can have group buys for stagea parts, were traders can offer items without having to pay a premium the the site owners and were members dont get banned for having a different opinions. when visiting other forums i abide by the rules but if i dont like the rules i wont break them i'll just go some place where he rules match me.

[clyde]

Originally Posted by jimbo54

As a Stagea OWNER and an unpaid non member and freeloader may l sugest that any forum member may vote

well said, you've the the nail right on the head. how can somebody who used to own a stagea have more influence over a community than somebody who does own the car and want to be a part of the community but not a club and calling none paid up members freeloaders just goes to show you have the tact of a nuclear bomb.

[hesh]

Originally Posted by Fuggles

As an ex-Stagea owner and a member of the NSOC and one of the people who attended the Innaugural General Meeting of the club (and acted as Secretary for the IGM) I would like to suggest that any vote should be to PAID MEMBERS only. Anyone else who has not contributed to the club financially clearly doesn't support the club and is happy to 'freeload' so should have no voting rights. Any vote should either be done by email or PM to the paid members, why is there a need for anonymity? The website Stagea.co.uk has been long establioshed by the NSOC as it's main information site and source and should be the place for the forum not some other site with an overly complex name.

As Chairman of the GTROC I am happy to say we as a club are pleased to have been involved in bringing together all Stagea enthusiasts and helping form the NSOC. However, we recognise the NSOC is it's own independent club and will support whatever decision is made by the NSOC membership

right lets go through this statement.

Ex stagea owner.... clyde's covered that one i think

Member of the NSOC acting as secretary... so you no longer own a stagea but feel that being a paid up member and secretary no less is important enough to put in here .....were's the relevence apart from to add weight to your argument via political positioning?

Not contributed to the club financially, and or not supporting the club. Money is one way of contributing to any organisation. How about time effort and information sharing....a club is more than a membership card, its supposed to be about the members not the coffers. Going to meets and investing in time to make either videos, or perhaps actual builds, non of this is free - though it is loading info into the collective membership of the owners fraternity.

as for PM and behind closed doors voting.. you mention anonymity. How about financially lead elitism? The aproach you advocate does more to elevate the club standings and perceived importance than it does to enhance the ownership experience.

Stagea.co.uk ...Has it? well I haven't used it. Obviously not all that well publicised for a new stagea owner such as myself. (allbeit one with links to the skyline owners forums) Attracting new members is a core of a forum's purpose.

As chairman of the GTROC- presumably you still own a GTR? I don't say this out of sarcasm, I'm genuinely wondering.

helping to form the NSOC- yes the owners of the mark owe a debt of gratitude to the GTROC for that, so credit is due.

and lastly..decisions made by NSOC membership. i presume from the content earlier in your post you mean those who've paid the joining fee in preference to those that actually own the cars, and therefore would be greatly affected by any decisions made at such votes?

Apologies if my replies seem overly sarcastic, however i have intimated in a previous post that "clubs" and"AGMS" and "Chairman" and "secretary" ....are all terms that frankly remind me of the types of individuals who wear rank out of uniform (for those that don't know i'm in the armed forces)

I again refer to a previous post. to some people the "club" is more important than the car. a case in point being when your still hugely politically active and influential in said club and don't actually own the relevant car any more.

Its all a question of individual priorities and perceived credibility really.

[TURBOJAGO]

Putting my own Chairman's hat on I have agonised over this issue for many years on the Jago forum, the result was a two tier forum so that potential new members can enjoy some of the benefits of membership and find out what the Club and it's members are all about yet those who have paid get access to another area which contains a lot of the technical info and where "Club" matters can be discussed thus ensuring that a guest can make the transition to paid up member after making their own mind up if they want to get involved, not unlike the member's area here on the GTROC site. The main thing is you don't have to wash your dirty linen in public if you have a problem it gets sorted in private without any outside influence from non members and what the potential member sees is a happy friendly and welcoming site that is sympathetically moderated to ensure the respectability of the Club is maintained at all times.

The problem for the NSOC is that it doesnt have it's own home therefore issues such as this have to be discussed in public, GTROC members are then free to add their own unnecessary remarks or even vote on an issue that doesnt even concern them, the down side of this forum is that any new Stagea owner finding this site will see recent discussions and choose not to get involved, especially if they have previous experience of online issues with a Club/Forum.

Sadly there is already a need amongst some Stagea owners to be anywhere as long as it isnt here or part of the NSOC which is not good news as there are barely enough vehicles here to sustain one organisation let alone two.

We are all individuals with our own opinions which may differ from those around us, we must all respect those other opinions for the greater good of the small Stagea community within the UK, currently Skylines outnumber Stageas something like 20 to 1 at some events so we are talking about a very rare an exclusive Club so lets be that and carve our own niche in the Japanese car culture in the UK.

Ok so I drive a Laurel, so what, it's near as dammit as quick as a Skyline, sounds just as good, and is far quicker than a standard Laurel, what about the old Skyline 240K GT wasnt that just a Laurel in a party frock?

It doesnt matter what it's parentage is, this isnt Crufts it's not a personal popularity contest either it's all about the cars and sticking together, here there or wherever what does it matter as long as Stagea owners stick together somewhere.