Top Speed

[RSVFOUR]

Originally Posted by projectdarkstar

In the day, Legacy GTB was the fastest estate with 162 mph top speed so it would be safe to assume that Stagea being heavier and bulkier will not be as fast. I'd say that 150 is about right if not a bit optimistic.

Plus autobox steals a few miles as well.

Your assumtions sre right for an RS Four but the GTB is the sports mdel so a fair comparison would be with the Autech RS260

A stock RS260 is cetainly faster than a legacy GTB (and I have driven both).
The RS 260s 0-60 time is better and the stagea is a heavier car so top end is bound to be higher. And they have manual boxes.
This is to be expected as you are basically looking at a slightly heavier GTR with slightly more drag .

Incedently Im pretty sure 162 is just as optimistic for a standard Subaru .

Finally this thread is about cars close to stock not moddded ones or the goalposts and figures will be on a different pitch

[projectdarkstar]

Originally Posted by RSVFOUR

Your assumtions sre right for an RS Four but the GTB is the sports mdel so a fair comparison would be with the Autech RS260

A stock RS260 is cetainly faster than a legacy GTB (and I have driven both).
The RS 260s 0-60 time is better and the stagea is a heavier car so top end is bound to be higher. And they have manual boxes.
This is to be expected as you are basically looking at a slightly heavier GTR with slightly more drag .

Incedently Im pretty sure 162 is just as optimistic for a standard Subaru .

Finally this thread is about cars close to stock not moddded ones or the goalposts and figures will be on a different pitch

I was comparing GTB with RS Four of course. As you pointed out we're talking stock, production cars here and Autech 260 can't quite be considered stock or production car. Its a great car, just not "stock".

Anyways, a while ago I was looking into 3 Jap estates - GTB, VR4 and Stagea and of the three from what I can gather Stagea was the slowest but the most roomy and comfortable. Please note that "slowest" doesn't mean slow as differences in top speed are small.
I always thought it would be nice to put 3 of those on a track and measure them against one another to get some real-world figures.
My Stagea top speed assumption was based purely on its weight, bulk and power. I would only compare manual versions as auto boxes are so different (and I should know having driven quite a few) that you can't really tell how good the car is until you put a manual box in it. I've driven some nice cars (like 3 liter Legacy) that were completelly spoiled by crapy autobox.

[jimbo54]

My last estate was a Legacy GT couldnt get rid of it fast enough, ln comparison to the stagea the Legacy handles better but is let down by the twin turbo set up, there is a lot of delay before the second turbo kicks in its so bad that Legacy owners call it the valley of death because of this l suspect that from a standing start over a short distance the stagea would leave the Legacy standing the GTB model isnt a lot better the main differences between the GT and GTB is the GTB has a different ecu and bilstien suspension.

[projectdarkstar]

Originally Posted by jimbo54

My last estate was a Legacy GT couldnt get rid of it fast enough, ln comparison to the stagea the Legacy handles better but is let down by the twin turbo set up, there is a lot of delay before the second turbo kicks in its so bad that Legacy owners call it the valley of death because of this l suspect that from a standing start over a short distance the stagea would leave the Legacy standing the GTB model isnt a lot better the main differences between the GT and GTB is the GTB has a different ecu and bilstien suspension.

That was my experience as well when I went to test drive one.
On top on the flat spot between twin turbos the autobox is just dreadful.

Having said that, top speed probably won't be affected by that flat spot.

[RSVFOUR]

if you are going to compare manual legacys to auto stageas the handling will always be better on a manual .

The only stagea that is a manual ( if you wont allow an autech into the game) is the series 2 RS Four S.

Handling is on par with any other estate and with HICAS much better. It has 280bhp completely stock (in fact its probably a little more) and most people seem to get nearly 25-30 mpg

But although we are comparing stock cars to keep things "fair" modding is allowed and this is where a stagea comes into its own (IMHO).
RB engines are far more tunable and the stock power can be improved beyond the level of either a VR4 or a legacy . By this I mean the level where you need a forged engine.

Handling can also be improved on a stagea very easily and to a quite surprsing level.

Of course I am biased (but this is a nissan forum)

[jimbo54]

l found the suspension on the legacy to be a little stiffer which gave less body roll, as for the rest of the car forget it the twin turbo set up is hopeless most tunners wont touch it, the engine is a pig to work on changing the plugs takes a couple of hours the clearance is so tight l had to lever the engine over just to get a plug socket in,
The build quality of the stagea is far superior as is the attention to detail, as said the RB engine is far more tunable

[projectdarkstar]

Originally Posted by RSVFOUR

if you are going to compare manual legacys to auto stageas the handling will always be better on a manual .

The only stagea that is a manual ( if you wont allow an autech into the game) is the series 2 RS Four S.

Handling is on par with any other estate and with HICAS much better. It has 280bhp completely stock (in fact its probably a little more) and most people seem to get nearly 25-30 mpg

But although we are comparing stock cars to keep things "fair" modding is allowed and this is where a stagea comes into its own (IMHO).
RB engines are far more tunable and the stock power can be improved beyond the level of either a VR4 or a legacy . By this I mean the level where you need a forged engine.

Handling can also be improved on a stagea very easily and to a quite surprsing level.

Of course I am biased (but this is a nissan forum)

As I said, I was thinking about manual boxes only and although RS FOUR S seems to be minority on the market, you can get them easy enough.

Tuning wise, you're 100% right. A year ago I was looking into getting a Q-car, maybe an estate. A goal vetted temporarily by my better half might I add .
A friend of mine bought a VR4 from NewEra (funny enough I showed him the car when I mentioned I'm looking for something new) and although stock engine (in manual form) is good for 280 bhp, getting past 320-350 seems almost impossible. Hardly any mods on the market and engine wasn't designed for that kind of power so needs forged guts. Without it you're throwing money away for little gain. As was mentioned in this thread - Legacy engine isn't better either and from what I gather twin turbo versions of EJ20 had bottom end problems.
RB on the other hand... well, there are plenty of GTS-Ts and GTTs running nice power. Hence my interest in Stagea but I can't quite get past it's exterior. MASA kit helps a long way but stock looks... nah.

[DE_GODFATHER]

I did a Top speed run in my car last year which managed a GPS 173mph but then the injector failed Doh !!!!!

Now it has a better built engine and running more power I would guess 180 maybe ...... Guess as I am having to sell the car I won't find out :-(

[RSVFOUR]

Ive not done a serious top speed run yet as need an organised place to do this properly but I think it will be the gearing (and my bottle ) that determines the top speed.

Its lower geared than a GTR as has the stagea diffs and 32GTR top gear .

At 150mph it still accelerates quite well so top speed will be determined by bottle
And I dont mean speed but just how much I am prepared to rev it in top gear.

This I suspect will be lower than the engine will do.

[wagzilla]

make a video....just in case "smile" I will run mine some time this summer, not sure what she will do?? but she is heavyer then a gtr so its like I having a fat chic riding with me 300lbs?

[rasored]

1996 Std. RSV4 with 18" wheels , So far 136mph at just under 5,000rpm , sat nav stated , guessing about 150 in standard form . Very Very stable at that speed down the A329m , ran out of petrol not road !!

[rasored]

Wagzilla , 300lbs is 2 fat chicks in the uk !! LOL

[rasored]

Nurburgring , raining so bottled it and waited for a dry line , 145mph last thing i saw as I reached the left brow at the end of the straight , the rest was a blur , occasionally seeing the whites of my knuckles flashing to and fro in my peripheral vision