Rubbish american muscle cars!

[Drag'Mera]

Originally Posted by skyline69_uk

That's because a big V8 is a hell of a lot easier to work on than high tech engines packed into an engine bay. I have a good engine rebuild book which is aimed at small block(!) pushrod V8s mainly and the whole thing is aimed at the home mechanic and the engines are pushing out over 400bhp and they seem to think you and your mate can do all the work on it with the right tools . It's a different culture and as the V8s have been around so long the tuning path is very well polished and things only go wrong if you're a numpty.

LOL...

I find it funny when people say that the RB26 and SR20 and so on are difficult to work on.

It's only nuts and bolts and they still need the same things to work.

If you get the fuelling & timing correct, you really can't go wrong.

[SkylineUSA]

skyline69_uk is right, the push rod engine are a lot easier to work on. You can do a cam change in less than an hour, try to do that on an RB

[COSSYCam]

Originally Posted by R33_GTS-t

So with a bigger English Gallon, they'd get 35mpg, or about the same as a 2.0 Mondeo.

As I say, I don't hate the cars, I just don't buy the figures. If it was possible, they'd have a 3.0 that makes 70mpg.

A close friend has a 2006 model Z06 Corvette with the LS7 427ci/7.0L motor and on a trip from Sheffield to Fort William and back which included motorway cruising at 80ish mph plus a couple of blasts to 150+, some very spirited A and B road driving once north of Glasgow and 70 mins of gridlock on the return journey on the M6 it averaged out at 23mpg. I have done a similar trip in the GTR and no way would it have returned more than 20mpg in fact 18mpg would be my estimate.

[R33_GTS-t]

Originally Posted by SkylineUSA

You forgot about the over 500hp part The Mondeo does not come close to that.

There was one Mondeo that did. Don't think it made 35mpg whilst doing it though.

[R33_GTS-t]

Originally Posted by Drag'Mera

LOL...

I find it funny when people say that the RB26 and SR20 and so on are difficult to work on.

It's only nuts and bolts and they still need the same things to work.

If you get the fuelling & timing correct, you really can't go wrong.

It's equally funny when people say the LS7 isn't high-tech just because it's a push-rod design.

[R33_GTS-t]

Originally Posted by COSSYCam

A close friend has a 2006 model Z06 Corvette with the LS7 427ci/7.0L motor and on a trip from Sheffield to Fort William and back which included motorway cruising at 80ish mph plus a couple of blasts to 150+, some very spirited A and B road driving once north of Glasgow and 70 mins of gridlock on the return journey on the M6 it averaged out at 23mpg. I have done a similar trip in the GTR and no way would it have returned more than 20mpg in fact 18mpg would be my estimate.

So why isn't there a 3.0 that does 70mpg?

Maybe you're right, it just doesn't sound likely.

[roadie]

The problem with the big three is they don't want to build a high output/small dispacement car to challenge their benchmark sports cars. Corvette, Viper, Mustang, all pack some serious displacement. What does GM have for a car to appeal to the "younger buyers" ?? Oh ya, the Colbalt SS !!!!! The level of tuning in America is among the highest in the world, but I'll bet most of the tuning shops in the US are filled with japanese cars.

[skyline69_uk]

Originally Posted by R33_GTS-t

So why isn't there a 3.0 that does 70mpg?

Maybe you're right, it just doesn't sound likely.

It doesn't work like that, if only it were that simple!

Due to a million and one things like heat loss due to surface area and inefficient burn on cool cylinder walls etc a big CC cylinder makes more sense and is more efficient BUT (there is always a but) as the cylinder gets bigger other factors mess this up like part throttle opening causing a low pressure volume to be overcome, weight and fiction of bigger parts and piston rings etc etc so it's not clear cut and simple by a VERY long way.

Engine design is a nightmare but I would have no doubt that the LS2 could make those mpgs especially with the DOD tech it uses.

There is not a lot of useful stuff on the net once you get to this level of wanting to know why but some stuff is here...

http://www.wdv.com/Hypercars/digiCam.html

that may be of use. You really need to buy a few books off Amazon etc to get to the bottom of the answers to "what is best" etc.

[SkylineUSA]

Originally Posted by R33_GTS-t

So why isn't there a 3.0 that does 70mpg?

Maybe you're right, it just doesn't sound likely.

The Vette is a very well engineered car, I hate to say it. And it looks darn good as well.

I know a lot of you hate American cars, but ask yourselves why? Does it have to do with tha cars, or the people they represent?

[COSSYCam]

Originally Posted by SkylineUSA

The Vette is a very well engineered car, I hate to say it. And it looks darn good as well.

I know a lot of you hate American cars, but ask yourselves why? Does it have to do with tha cars, or the people they represent?

Another little fact about the C6 Z06 Corvette - A stock tyred one lapped the Ring in 7:42.9 which is faster than a Z-tune R34!

[COSSYCam]

Originally Posted by R33_GTS-t

So why isn't there a 3.0 that does 70mpg?

Maybe you're right, it just doesn't sound likely.

By your severely flawed logic why isn't there a 1000cc car that does 150+mpg?

[gtrlux]

Originally Posted by COSSYCam

Another little fact about the C6 Z06 Corvette - A stock tyred one lapped the Ring in 7:42.9 which is faster than a Z-tune R34!

That's true, but the R-Tune single Ring try is not relevant . . . in the next years there will hundreds of Z06s chasing the curves of the ring, driven by the best pilots, who are knowing the course.
But I think if those same best pilotes would try the course with the Z-Tune for one year, it will beat the corvette . . as it is only RWD, and the Z-Tune has not only the 50K 4X4 for show.

[COSSYCam]

Originally Posted by gtrlux

That's true, but the R-Tune single Ring try is not relevant . . . in the next years there will hundreds of Z06s chasing the curves of the ring, driven by the best pilots, who are knowing the course.
But I think if those same best pilotes would try the course with the Z-Tune for one year, it will beat the corvette . . as it is only RWD, and the Z-Tune has not only the 50K 4X4 for show.

Nissan use the best drivers as well. 9 out of 10 of the fastest roadcars round the 'Ring are RWD.

[SkylineUSA]

Aren't you comparing a factory car (Z06), to a aftermaket tuned car (Z-Tune)? How is that even fair? That a stock Z06 and a stock R34 GTR against each other, guess who wins?

[Drag'Mera]

Originally Posted by SkylineUSA

skyline69_uk is right, the push rod engine are a lot easier to work on. You can do a cam change in less than an hour, try to do that on an RB

OK...I can do a cam change (both of them) on an high port SR20DE(T) in around 1.5 hours.

But take an DAF XE 12.6 pushrod engine as found in a DAF 85 & 95 (just an example of a big pushrod engine).

It would take me at least 8 hours to do this.

Just because it takes longer, doesn't necessarily mean that it takes longer, just a lot more crap to take off & out...LOL!

Cheers

Dave