Anyone Fancy A Group B Legend??? - Page 2 - GT-R Register - Official Nissan Skyline and GTR Owners Club forum

tarmac terror · 21st June 2008, 11:06 AM

I see this now has a 'buy it now' for £75k.

Surprising that there has been no interest on Ebay. Mind you not the sort of place you would expect to find an RS200 i suppose.

TT

tarmac terror · 21st June 2008, 09:09 PM

OMFG!!!!
Been browsing (again) to see what groupB stuff is out there and I found this:-

Link

And, my personal favourite:-

Link

Unfortunately both POA so no indication of price range

:

TT

tuRBy · 21st June 2008, 10:10 PM

above: both awesome

rs200, 23psi as std....well that explains it

, I have also seen 6-700bhp power outputs quoted

for a 1.8litre thats amazing, if only for [apparently] 10 hours on full blast.....

bladerider · 22nd June 2008, 12:10 AM

A bit of actual info,

Although this is from memory having had a couple of sherbets so bear with me,

1.8 BDT's tend to run out of puff at about 450-500bhp
2.1 Evo spec with BDT-E (I think) were built to allow upto 800bhp which is where any confusion is coming from about horsepower per litre, but in fairness dont forget this is now relatively common in Evos and so on so its by no means wizardry !! At the same time BMW for example was stretchin 1200bhp+ out of 2002ti engines in formula one with only 1.5litre displacement although these engines were expected to withstand upto 5bar of boost for a couple of hours which kind of puts it into perspective !!

10hours full throttle is most likely the lifespan of the consumables in something like an Evo spec engine that is running full power on a rally and hence probably only has to withstand that for the full course of the rally before getting stripped and rebuilt. I know several of the people involved with these engines during the Group B and subsequent WRC era so will have to remember to ask when I get a chance, in fact ANY Ford Cosworth YB motorsport engine had its crank balanced by the guy whose business is about a half mile from where Im sitting !!

The 205 T16 would go for 30-50k as a standard road version or 40=100k for a full spec rally car depending on history.

The 037 would be significantly more as they were even rarer and I dont recall them being homologated for road use, so would most likely be a race car and worth a fecking fortune - last one I saw was expected to reach £250k+ at auction.

Most the classic group B's go for 50-100k, ferrari, porsche being the obvious ones that dont !!

J.

tarmac terror · 22nd June 2008, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bladerider

The 205 T16 would go for 30-50k as a standard road version or 40-100k for a full spec rally car depending on history

I agree, these are the sorts of prices that are most commonly seen although an ex Ari vatanen car with LOADS of history and wins went for something close to £150k IIRC. But the spec, spares package and pedigree were all highly impressive. My kind of car

Quote:

The 037 would be significantly more as they were even rarer and I dont recall them being homologated for road use, so would most likely be a race car and worth a fecking fortune - last one I saw was expected to reach £250k+ at auction.

While I'm not going to stick my neck out so far as to completely disagree I would say that I have seen a fair few road-spec 037's. In fact if you follow the lokk below the yellow comp car above there is a lovely red one for sale also in road trim.

Whether or not you could drive it on the road is another matter but I would suspect you could. I shall have to do a bit more digging

Always nice to find some fellow Group B afficinado's

TT

banzai g · 22nd June 2008, 08:37 AM

205 T16 every time For me !!!!!!!

Heres a link to makela auto tuning !!!!
MAT - Makela Auto Tuning - HISTORIC SPORTS AND RACING CAR SPECIALIST
Theyve restored and sold some group B and early group A rally cars.
Full photo diary of the build.

GTR_Cymru · 22nd June 2008, 08:51 AM

I've actually been at the wheel of an RS200, albeit one of Ford's display models on the 1986 International Welsh Rally!

The way prices are going for humble escorts £75k for this RS200 seems a good investment.

Talking about the price of escorts, are people completely barmy paying 5 figure sums for what are usually very average cars. There's a few on ebay at the moment, and the owners are dreamers!

tarmac terror · 22nd June 2008, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTR_Cymru

I've actually been at the wheel of an RS200, albeit one of Ford's display models on the 1986 International Welsh Rally!

The way prices are going for humble escorts £75k for this RS200 seems a good investment.

Talking about the price of escorts, are people completely barmy paying 5 figure sums for what are usually very average cars. There's a few on ebay at the moment, and the owners are dreamers!

Your not wrong there!!! Seen a few RS2000's go for £15k+

Which, it must be said were of a similar, if not inferior spec to my old RS2000 which I sold for £3k which was top dollar back then.

Historic rallying has become VER popular of late which probably accounts for the silly money. Even boggo base 2-door MKII's are fetching serious money so even going down the 'I'll build one from scratch' route is not as cheap as it once was.

Best one I saw was last year IIRC where someone was selling a Gp4 spec MKII for...............wait for it.............................

£80k, yes......eighty thousand pounds

I dont know if it sold at that price but thats insane money for a MKII.

TT

tarmac terror · 22nd June 2008, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by banzai g

Heres a link to makela auto tuning !!!!
MAT - Makela Auto Tuning - HISTORIC SPORTS AND RACING CAR SPECIALIST

That has to be the link of the decade for me..........truly fabulous!!!

TT

GTR_Cymru · 22nd June 2008, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarmac terror

Your not wrong there!!! Seen a few RS2000's go for £15k+

Which, it must be said were of a similar, if not inferior spec to my old RS2000 which I sold for £3k which was top dollar back then.

Historic rallying has become VER popular of late which probably accounts for the silly money. Even boggo base 2-door MKII's are fetching serious money so even going down the 'I'll build one from scratch' route is not as cheap as it once was.

Best one I saw was last year IIRC where someone was selling a Gp4 spec MKII for...............wait for it.............................

£80k, yes......eighty thousand pounds

I dont know if it sold at that price but thats insane money for a MKII.

TT

I've been around escorts for about 25 years. I owned and restored a 1300E and sold that for £2.5k 22 years ago, which was a lot of money for a Mk 1 in those days. These days that sort of money would only buy a knackered shell.

I do have a logbook and ID plates for a P suffix Mk1 RS2000, which I'm thinking of putting up for sale on ebay!

In recent years a friend has built a Mk1 RS2000 rally car and apparently spent £35k. Another friend is Robin Bradbury who probably owns the best Mk2 Escort rally car, although he's not used the car for a couple of years! It has a 310bhp 2.5 litre millington diamond running through a quaife 6 speed sequential box, and on a dry day will give the group A cars a run for their money!

For me, if I had the money it would have to be a ex works Audi Quattro S1.

banzai g · 22nd June 2008, 09:28 AM

Glad you enjoyed !!!!

Mk2 Escorts are fetching crazy money, i know a man who has a rs2000 ,very low miles prob the best ive ever seen !
Turned down 25k for it !
As for mk2 rally cars , over here the rally men are spending anything form 6ok -90k building them.

GTR_Cymru · 22nd June 2008, 09:53 AM

There's a place in Italy that's always got ex works Group B stuff for sale, from memory they're called Autoieri

emu002 · 22nd June 2008, 11:48 AM

RS200 one of my favourite cars of all time )

Always had a soft spot for fast fords - they have somthing special about them that you cant put into words

bladerider · 22nd June 2008, 03:22 PM

Fella up the road has just finished his Grp4 MkII

Offered to swap it for my GT3 !!! and has it up for £39,995 !!!

Wizsy is building a nice old Ford with a Millington and a Quaife, in fact the MkII was his dads rally car that was all but destroyed a couple of years ago which the chap I know has rebuilt.

Will have a good look round that link thanks Banzai, Group B is what I grew up adoring and living round this area in mid essex kinda means I have to be a Ford man as its in the soil in these parts !!!

A good sized lottery win would immediately see me with one of each of the "B's"

I love them,

J.

SteveN · 23rd June 2008, 11:18 PM

Capacity has no real bearing on the BDA's bhp limit, reason it was increased was simply it could be and still be within the rules.

IIRC they are all T4 framed turbos as standard, though standard one isnt exactly massive, but still good for 400odd IIRC.

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21st June 2008, 11:06 AM	#16 (permalink)
tarmac terror New Users Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Hampshire, but Scottish through and through! Posts: 2,622	I see this now has a 'buy it now' for £75k. Surprising that there has been no interest on Ebay. Mind you not the sort of place you would expect to find an RS200 i suppose. TT

21st June 2008, 09:09 PM	#17 (permalink)
tarmac terror New Users Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Hampshire, but Scottish through and through! Posts: 2,622	OMFG!!!! Been browsing (again) to see what groupB stuff is out there and I found this:- Link And, my personal favourite:- Link Unfortunately both POA so no indication of price range : TT

21st June 2008, 10:10 PM	#18 (permalink)
tuRBy GTR Register Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 547	above: both awesome rs200, 23psi as std....well that explains it , I have also seen 6-700bhp power outputs quoted for a 1.8litre thats amazing, if only for [apparently] 10 hours on full blast.....

22nd June 2008, 12:10 AM	#19 (permalink)
bladerider GTR Register Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Soon to be in a fridge !!! Posts: 5,023	A bit of actual info, Although this is from memory having had a couple of sherbets so bear with me, 1.8 BDT's tend to run out of puff at about 450-500bhp 2.1 Evo spec with BDT-E (I think) were built to allow upto 800bhp which is where any confusion is coming from about horsepower per litre, but in fairness dont forget this is now relatively common in Evos and so on so its by no means wizardry !! At the same time BMW for example was stretchin 1200bhp+ out of 2002ti engines in formula one with only 1.5litre displacement although these engines were expected to withstand upto 5bar of boost for a couple of hours which kind of puts it into perspective !! 10hours full throttle is most likely the lifespan of the consumables in something like an Evo spec engine that is running full power on a rally and hence probably only has to withstand that for the full course of the rally before getting stripped and rebuilt. I know several of the people involved with these engines during the Group B and subsequent WRC era so will have to remember to ask when I get a chance, in fact ANY Ford Cosworth YB motorsport engine had its crank balanced by the guy whose business is about a half mile from where Im sitting !! The 205 T16 would go for 30-50k as a standard road version or 40=100k for a full spec rally car depending on history. The 037 would be significantly more as they were even rarer and I dont recall them being homologated for road use, so would most likely be a race car and worth a fecking fortune - last one I saw was expected to reach £250k+ at auction. Most the classic group B's go for 50-100k, ferrari, porsche being the obvious ones that dont !! J.

22nd June 2008, 08:37 AM	#21 (permalink)
banzai g GTR Register Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: bushmills northern ireland Posts: 419	205 T16 every time For me !!!!!!! Heres a link to makela auto tuning !!!! MAT - Makela Auto Tuning - HISTORIC SPORTS AND RACING CAR SPECIALIST Theyve restored and sold some group B and early group A rally cars. Full photo diary of the build.

22nd June 2008, 08:51 AM	#22 (permalink)
GTR_Cymru New Users Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Herts & Wales Posts: 549	I've actually been at the wheel of an RS200, albeit one of Ford's display models on the 1986 International Welsh Rally! The way prices are going for humble escorts £75k for this RS200 seems a good investment. Talking about the price of escorts, are people completely barmy paying 5 figure sums for what are usually very average cars. There's a few on ebay at the moment, and the owners are dreamers!

22nd June 2008, 09:28 AM	#26 (permalink)
banzai g GTR Register Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: bushmills northern ireland Posts: 419	Glad you enjoyed !!!! Mk2 Escorts are fetching crazy money, i know a man who has a rs2000 ,very low miles prob the best ive ever seen ! Turned down 25k for it ! As for mk2 rally cars , over here the rally men are spending anything form 6ok -90k building them.

22nd June 2008, 09:53 AM	#27 (permalink)
GTR_Cymru New Users Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Herts & Wales Posts: 549	There's a place in Italy that's always got ex works Group B stuff for sale, from memory they're called Autoieri

22nd June 2008, 11:48 AM	#28 (permalink)
emu002 GTR Register Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Derbyshire Posts: 59	RS200 one of my favourite cars of all time ) Always had a soft spot for fast fords - they have somthing special about them that you cant put into words

22nd June 2008, 03:22 PM	#29 (permalink)
bladerider GTR Register Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Soon to be in a fridge !!! Posts: 5,023	Fella up the road has just finished his Grp4 MkII Offered to swap it for my GT3 !!! and has it up for £39,995 !!! Wizsy is building a nice old Ford with a Millington and a Quaife, in fact the MkII was his dads rally car that was all but destroyed a couple of years ago which the chap I know has rebuilt. Will have a good look round that link thanks Banzai, Group B is what I grew up adoring and living round this area in mid essex kinda means I have to be a Ford man as its in the soil in these parts !!! A good sized lottery win would immediately see me with one of each of the "B's" I love them, J.

23rd June 2008, 11:18 PM	#30 (permalink)
SteveN GTR Register Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Just off the M5/A40 Posts: 7,171	Capacity has no real bearing on the BDA's bhp limit, reason it was increased was simply it could be and still be within the rules. IIRC they are all T4 framed turbos as standard, though standard one isnt exactly massive, but still good for 400odd IIRC.