So who wants a free SKYLINE 2000 GT-R ... - Page 3 - GT-R Register - Nissan Skyline and GT-R Drivers Club forum

Want to buy a banner ad? Find out more here.

Go Back   GT-R Register - Nissan Skyline and GT-R Drivers Club forum > General > General Nissan Skyline Chat
Register Garage FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Insurance


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 29th September 2012, 06:48 PM   #41 (permalink)
PS30-SB is having a nice cup of tea
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
PS30-SB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London, UK.
Cars owned: Genuine HS30-H x 2, HLS30, Replica PS30-SB project, genuine KPGC10.
Posts: 848
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue34 View Post
I'll post a picture of Dave's car

..and within seconds I'll be told it's not this that or the other... by the forum's very own KPGC10 expert.

Anyways here is a picture of Dave Warener's car (the GTR shop)

Which may or may not be a 2 door PGC10 allegedly and as I'm no expert I wouldn't know.
Well, I wouldn't necessarily call myself a "KPGC10 expert" ( thanks for the kudos though... ), but I am a KPGC10 owner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue34
I do know however for the majority of people who aren't quite so pedantic about such things... it's proof we have a member right now in the UK with a car of that vintage and series with a genuine interest in restoring it - note the engine isn't back in yet... and everyone appreciated a chance to see it at JAE.

So why not tell us a little bit about what you see in the photo and share some of that knowledge for the benefit of those less knowledgeable
Dave's car is a KGC10. Note the lack of the 'P' code. The 'P' code in the 'KPGC10' prefix denotes S20 twin cam engine - and all the other special GT-R specific parts that came with it - and distinguishes it from its less exclusive GT and GT-X siblings. Dave's car originally came from the factory with an L20A single cam engine and none of the GT-R specific parts, but he's modifying it to look like a KPGC10 GT-R.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue34
or would you rather just tell us it doesn't count and we are liars, your call...
Are you saying that Dave's car is the car that's being claimed as a "KPGC10" in the GTROC blurb then? If so, I'm afraid you'll find that it doesn't count. Just as a GTS is quite different from a GT-R in the R32-series, as I'm sure you know. Dave's car quite simply is NOT a GT-R. It's a lovely car, and he's doing a great job I'm sure, but it will always be a modified KGC10 and not a KPGC10.

"Liars"? They are your words not mine. I'd prefer to think that you are just mistaken. Whichever, it needs clarifying or correcting doesn't it? The GTROC should be able to tell the difference, and if it can't then it's hardly fit for purpose. "Pedantic"? I'd say it's just a case of knowing what a real GT-R is, and that - it seems to me - is surely part of the responsibility of an organisation that calls itself the 'GTR Owners Club'?



Perhaps it might help you to understand why I'm being so vocal about this if you put yourself in my position. How would you feel if you owned a genuine KPGC10, and found that the GTROC in the UK seemingly couldn't tell the difference between a real one and a lookalike? Can you imagine that happening within the GTROC Japan?
__________________
PS30-SB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2012, 06:54 PM   #42 (permalink)
RSVFOUR is has actually finished his 32GTR
GT-RDC Member
 
RSVFOUR's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Jap perfomance mag Nov 2010
Cars owned: Giken powered Stagea , 32GTR , Brabus SLK, 1973 Porsche 911 , Autech Axis Stagea
Posts: 4,447
Its nice to see being pedantic made into an artform
__________________
aka The Grean Machine


My website -
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
RSVFOUR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2012, 08:08 PM   #43 (permalink)
slacker is -thinking R33
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
slacker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Cars owned: Series 3 R33 GTR
Posts: 742
Quote:
Originally Posted by PS30-SB View Post
Sorry, with one what?
KPGC10 i can do Italics too, Does that make me smart?!
__________________
slacker is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 29th September 2012, 08:58 PM   #44 (permalink)
PS30-SB is having a nice cup of tea
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
PS30-SB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London, UK.
Cars owned: Genuine HS30-H x 2, HLS30, Replica PS30-SB project, genuine KPGC10.
Posts: 848
Quote:
Originally Posted by RSVFOUR
Its nice to see being pedantic made into an artform
Practice makes perfect.



Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker
KPGC10
Here's a straight question then; Have you actually SEEN this 'KPGC10' in Northern Ireland, and are you 100% sure it's a genuine KPGC10 ( rather than a GC10, KGC10 or even a KGC110 / KHGC110 )? "I've heard there's one" or "my mum's postman's friend's uncle has got one of those" doesn't really cut it, I'm afraid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker[/i
i can do Italics too, Does that make me smart?!
About the italics: I'm not trying to be "smart", just legible. That's the whole point of spelling, grammar and punctuation, shirley?



See, this is what happens isn't it? You guys spend all your time shooting the messenger when you should be addressing the message. Either come up with the proof that a member of the UK GTROC actually owns a genuine KPGC10, or stop making the claim. I've been asking the same question for years and have never got a straight answer. I sometimes get asked if it's my car, but I'm not a member.....
__________________
PS30-SB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2012, 09:10 PM   #45 (permalink)
JTJUDGE is 70% there
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
JTJUDGE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Glasgow
Cars owned: R33 GTR X2, next is the r32 (stockish)
Posts: 4,573
I'd maybe give up then and stop asking because if there is an owner on here that is a member, you will never find him or his address so that you can take Pervy pics of his car

Anyway these Kentucky fried chicken cars remind me off eastern European boy racer lada's
__________________
JTJUDGE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2012, 09:12 PM   #46 (permalink)
TAZZMAXX is ...............
ADMIN
 
TAZZMAXX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 13,345
Quote:
Originally Posted by PS30-SB View Post
.....but I'm not a member.....
I don't suppose you fancy joining up then, do you? I'm sure they'd be glad to have you on board
__________________
Ambition is the last refuge of failure
TAZZMAXX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2012, 09:35 PM   #47 (permalink)
slacker is -thinking R33
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
slacker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Cars owned: Series 3 R33 GTR
Posts: 742
Quote:
Originally Posted by PS30-SB View Post
Here's a straight question then; Have you actually SEEN this 'KPGC10' in Northern Ireland, and are you 100% sure it's a genuine KPGC10 ( rather than a GC10, KGC10 or even a KGC110 / KHGC110 )? "I've heard there's one" or "my mum's postman's friend's uncle has got one of those" doesn't really cut it, I'm afraid.
Seen it, Sat in it. A genuine KPGC10.
__________________
slacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2012, 10:57 PM   #48 (permalink)
JTJUDGE is 70% there
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
JTJUDGE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Glasgow
Cars owned: R33 GTR X2, next is the r32 (stockish)
Posts: 4,573
Does it have the dot after the digit 0? Do you have pics of the occasion because it's not true if you don't
__________________
JTJUDGE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 01:34 AM   #49 (permalink)
YokoAE86 is enjoying life
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
YokoAE86's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 376
Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker View Post
Seen it, Sat in it. A genuine KPGC10.
Show me the pics of the car then. What colour is it and i want to see the engine bay please.
__________________
YokoAE86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 02:18 AM   #50 (permalink)
blue34 is in a Fujimura Auto 32GTR
GTROC Member
 
blue34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hampshire
Cars owned: R34GTR
Posts: 3,226
Quote:
Originally Posted by PS30-SB View Post
Well, I wouldn't necessarily call myself a "KPGC10 expert" ( thanks for the kudos though... ), but I am a KPGC10 owner.



Dave's car is a KGC10. Note the lack of the 'P' code. The 'P' code in the 'KPGC10' prefix denotes S20 twin cam engine - and all the other special GT-R specific parts that came with it - and distinguishes it from its less exclusive GT and GT-X siblings. Dave's car originally came from the factory with an L20A single cam engine and none of the GT-R specific parts, but he's modifying it to look like a KPGC10 GT-R.

That's useful info, so it's a KGC10. I think it came over with for example the rear arch extensions, not sure if they are an original feature of the PGC10 I'm guessing not. I can understand now why so KGC10 examples would have had mods to more resemble the more exclusive KPGC10.

Best way to settle the argument about owners in the club would be I guess to "serve" you with a membership card.

But first you have to pass the "Custard Test" - google it...
__________________
blue34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 02:41 AM   #51 (permalink)
JTJUDGE is 70% there
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
JTJUDGE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Glasgow
Cars owned: R33 GTR X2, next is the r32 (stockish)
Posts: 4,573
that key pic was a funny read
__________________
JTJUDGE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 06:59 AM   #52 (permalink)
xs10shl is unaware they can edit their status
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 16
A typical clone I've seen will either still have it's chrome rain gutter, or have the chrome removed, but the notch in the bare rain gutter to accept the chrome would usually still be there. Both would be absent in a KPGC10, replaced by a steel gutter in body color (if I'm saying that right - hope that's not too confusing. Moreover, I hope it's accurate - I defer to Alan on all detail-oriented items.).
__________________

Last edited by xs10shl; 1st October 2012 at 12:24 AM..
xs10shl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 10:00 AM   #53 (permalink)
PS30-SB is having a nice cup of tea
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
PS30-SB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London, UK.
Cars owned: Genuine HS30-H x 2, HLS30, Replica PS30-SB project, genuine KPGC10.
Posts: 848
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue34 View Post
That's useful info, so it's a KGC10.
Useful info? It's engraved on the car! The chassis number is prefixed by the build code, and on Dave's car it's stamped into the engine bay VIN tag, and engraved on the left side sill top. It's the identity of the car, and you can't change it. This is all really basic stuff.

Dave's car is an interesting project - well covered on the forum - and I'm sure its great advertising for his business, but you can't cite it as validation of the GTROC's claim to have a KPGC10 in the club because it's simply not a KPGC10. It's a C10-series Skyline, it's a two door pillarless 'hard-top' coupe with a six cylinder engine, but it's a million miles away from being any kind of substitute for a genuine C10-series GT-R.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue34
I think it came over with for example the rear arch extensions, not sure if they are an original feature of the PGC10 I'm guessing not. I can understand now why so KGC10 examples would have had mods to more resemble the more exclusive KPGC10.
No offence, but you really need to get the chassis codes straight in your mind before you start talking about these cars. You've mentioned the 'PGC10' a couple of times, but the PGC10 was the four door sedan bodied GT-R, the very first GT-R, introduced in February 1969, and it didn't have the cut-away rear arches and overfenders of the KPGC10 that followed it in October 1970. It also had a longer wheelbase than the KGC10 and KPGC10.

Dave's car came over from Japan with slightly modified rear arches ( the GT and GT-X two doors originally came with the full 'Surf Line' rear arch that severely limits wider wheel fitment ) but not fully cut-away GT-R sheetmetal and FRP Overfenders. Dave cut these modified arches out and did the full GT-R style treatment on them. All documented on his build threads here and on other forums.

Since their debut in Japan, GC10s have often been modified to look like PGC10s, and KGC10s have often been modifed to look like KPGC10s ( and KGC110s to look like the even rarer KPGC110s ). The GT-R models were the premium performance models with all the kudos and race history that came with that, and it was only natural that people who owned cheaper, more numerous and easily accessible models would modify them to look like the GT-Rs. The same thing happened all over the car world; As a teenager I modified my MkI Cortina GT to look like a Lotus Cortina because the LC was the coolest MkI as far as I was concerned, and a cooking C10-series Skyline being modified to look like one of its more illustrious siblings is essentially the same scenario. Nothing wrong with lookalikes or replicas, but they are not to be confused with The Real Thing...

Usually it's down to owners, owners clubs and enthusiasts groups ( like special interest internet forum members ) to police the differences and protect the integrity and history of the marque and model, but the UK GTROC doesn't seem to do it for the models that actually created GT-R history. I have no doubt that any member who showed up with an ER34 wearing GT-R badges would soon get shown the error of his ways, especially if he parked up next to a genuine BNR34 and started telling people that it was "the same thing". Why not the same for the C10 and C110-series cars then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue34
Best way to settle the argument about owners in the club would be I guess to "serve" you with a membership card.

But first you have to pass the "Custard Test" - google it...
I don't need to Google it. I'm a long-term Pistonheads forum member and I've asked - earlier this year actually - a fellow Pistonheads member to come up with the goods regarding a KGC10 that he claims to own and has been very vocal about. As so often seems to be the case ( funny this... ) he has never shown a pic of the car or come forward with any details about it, despite spouting off about it being cheaper than people say they usually are, and offering all sorts of opinion about importing one. He hasn't even told us what colour it is. Bizarre. It's hard to resist the thought that he might be a little bit of a fantasist....

My car's not any kind of secret. I don't think it needs a Custard Test to prove that it's over here, is owned by me, lives in North London and is a genuine KPGC10 Skyline 2000 GT-R:

THE OUTSIDER. HAKOSUKA GTR IN EUROPE... - Speedhunters
__________________
PS30-SB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 10:08 AM   #54 (permalink)
PS30-SB is having a nice cup of tea
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
PS30-SB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London, UK.
Cars owned: Genuine HS30-H x 2, HLS30, Replica PS30-SB project, genuine KPGC10.
Posts: 848
Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker View Post
Seen it, Sat in it. A genuine KPGC10.
Pistonheads patent Custard Test then, please.

And are you quite sure you're up to speed on these cars? Sure you can tell the difference? There was a guy standing in front of my car at Goodwood - peering into the engine bay even - who was convinced he was looking at a 510 Bluebird. There's a lot of that about.

More details or - yes - it might just as well be Brigadoon....
__________________
PS30-SB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 11:54 AM   #55 (permalink)
blitzer_bhoy is working on an R35 GTR
Registered
 
blitzer_bhoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Glasgow
Cars owned: Civic Coupe, Toyota Supra, Honda Prelude Motegi 2.2vti, R33 GTST Type M Stage 1, R33 GTR VSpec Stage 1, Civic Type R, R32 GTR
Posts: 1,123
PS30-SB...thanks for providing such detailed information, its been a very interesting read and your well structured responses, educational to say the least.
__________________
blitzer_bhoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 12:29 PM   #56 (permalink)
blue34 is in a Fujimura Auto 32GTR
GTROC Member
 
blue34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hampshire
Cars owned: R34GTR
Posts: 3,226
Quote:
Originally Posted by PS30-SB View Post
Useful info? It's engraved on the car! The chassis number is prefixed by the build code, and on Dave's car it's stamped into the engine bay VIN tag, and engraved on the left side sill top. It's the identity of the car, and you can't change it. This is all really basic stuff.

Dave's car is an interesting project - well covered on the forum - and I'm sure its great advertising for his business, but you can't cite it as validation of the GTROC's claim to have a KPGC10 in the club because it's simply not a KPGC10. It's a C10-series Skyline, it's a two door pillarless 'hard-top' coupe with a six cylinder engine, but it's a million miles away from being any kind of substitute for a genuine C10-series GT-R.



No offence, but you really need to get the chassis codes straight in your mind before you start talking about these cars. You've mentioned the 'PGC10' a couple of times, but the PGC10 was the four door sedan bodied GT-R, the very first GT-R, introduced in February 1969, and it didn't have the cut-away rear arches and overfenders of the KPGC10 that followed it in October 1970. It also had a longer wheelbase than the KGC10 and KPGC10.

Dave's car came over from Japan with slightly modified rear arches ( the GT and GT-X two doors originally came with the full 'Surf Line' rear arch that severely limits wider wheel fitment ) but not fully cut-away GT-R sheetmetal and FRP Overfenders. Dave cut these modified arches out and did the full GT-R style treatment on them. All documented on his build threads here and on other forums.

Since their debut in Japan, GC10s have often been modified to look like PGC10s, and KGC10s have often been modifed to look like KPGC10s ( and KGC110s to look like the even rarer KPGC110s ). The GT-R models were the premium performance models with all the kudos and race history that came with that, and it was only natural that people who owned cheaper, more numerous and easily accessible models would modify them to look like the GT-Rs. The same thing happened all over the car world; As a teenager I modified my MkI Cortina GT to look like a Lotus Cortina because the LC was the coolest MkI as far as I was concerned, and a cooking C10-series Skyline being modified to look like one of its more illustrious siblings is essentially the same scenario. Nothing wrong with lookalikes or replicas, but they are not to be confused with The Real Thing...

Usually it's down to owners, owners clubs and enthusiasts groups ( like special interest internet forum members ) to police the differences and protect the integrity and history of the marque and model, but the UK GTROC doesn't seem to do it for the models that actually created GT-R history. I have no doubt that any member who showed up with an ER34 wearing GT-R badges would soon get shown the error of his ways, especially if he parked up next to a genuine BNR34 and started telling people that it was "the same thing". Why not the same for the C10 and C110-series cars then?



I don't need to Google it. I'm a long-term Pistonheads forum member and I've asked - earlier this year actually - a fellow Pistonheads member to come up with the goods regarding a KGC10 that he claims to own and has been very vocal about. As so often seems to be the case ( funny this... ) he has never shown a pic of the car or come forward with any details about it, despite spouting off about it being cheaper than people say they usually are, and offering all sorts of opinion about importing one. He hasn't even told us what colour it is. Bizarre. It's hard to resist the thought that he might be a little bit of a fantasist....

My car's not any kind of secret. I don't think it needs a Custard Test to prove that it's over here, is owned by me, lives in North London and is a genuine KPGC10 Skyline 2000 GT-R:

THE OUTSIDER. HAKOSUKA GTR IN EUROPE... - Speedhunters
and here is a very nice photo of your car from the Speedhunters article




(re: Cortinas and Datsuns I went the V6 route with my MkII Cortina as a teenager, and owned a Datsun 240z for twenty odd years..)
__________________

Last edited by blue34; 30th September 2012 at 12:34 PM..
blue34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 01:23 PM   #57 (permalink)
JapFreak786 is .
GT-RDC Member
 
JapFreak786's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 8,042
Will a Y pipe in valid my warranty though?? Just trying to keep the entertainment going!
__________________
‘95 R33 GTR
JapFreak786 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 08:15 PM   #58 (permalink)
matty32 is In tokyo
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
matty32's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 24,946
just read through all of this.

couple of points.

if your going to run a competition - just remember not everyone is or wants to be on face book - its not for everyone.

regarding the GT-R

i think 99% of people on here would be shouting if someone was calling a ECR33 a BCNR33, its therefore the same thing.

if someone claims they have it, then pictures (9/10) prove alot. so post up. nothing wrong with that.

it is helpful having PS30 explain about the GT-R differences.

we found this one in the Toyota highlight in Tokyo.

thought id post a couple of pics















__________________
matty32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 08:18 PM   #59 (permalink)
DNCracing is unaware they can edit their status
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 21
Yes please I would like another. But how do I know this is not some new Nigerian scam?
__________________
DNCracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2012, 08:39 PM   #60 (permalink)
JapFreak786 is .
GT-RDC Member
 
JapFreak786's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Birmingham
Posts: 8,042
Greetings bot
__________________
‘95 R33 GTR
JapFreak786 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 11:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
http://www.Tyreforums.com

tyreforums

 

Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.