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Old 1st August 2013, 08:51 PM   #1 (permalink)
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brake upgrade

I've never had to replace brake discs on anything like the GTR before so forgive me if this an obvious question...

My front discs need replacing due to cracking. I am looking at just getting the alcon 380mm rotors which fit the OEM bells as i don;t think i need the 400mm upgrade for just road driving and i'm not fussed about saving a bit of weight with the upgraded bells.

My question is do i need to change my pads as well if they're still looking ok? And if do upgrade the pads (thinking pagids) do i need to upgrade the rear pads at the same time? The rear discs are looking in good shape and i'm planning on getting a bit more life out of these.

Thanks in advance and don't me for asking stupid questions!!
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Old 1st August 2013, 08:58 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I believe you can just change the discs and youll be fine. And you can run different pads front and rear (the purists will state different im sure)
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Old 1st August 2013, 08:59 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Mate it is good practice and highly recommended when ever changing any discs to change pads as well. It's needed because the pad will have a certain shape moulded into it from the old disc and as such they won't make full contact with your new disc. Then they will eventually wear your new sparkly discs int the same old shape. Off course I could be talking rubbish lol.

I changed mine to the 380 alcons and went the Cosworth pads. I don't track her and they have been more than enough for even my spirited driving style ; )

Re the rears, I didn't change mine and have not noticed any undue side effects.

Hope this helps matey.
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Old 1st August 2013, 09:24 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Cheers guys.

So I should definately replace front pads and discs together.

But don't necessarily need to replace the rear pads if they're looking ok.
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Old 1st August 2013, 09:39 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Mate it is good practice and highly recommended when ever changing any discs to change pads as well. It's needed because the pad will have a certain shape moulded into it from the old disc and as such they won't make full contact with your new disc.
Makes sense
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Old 1st August 2013, 09:52 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Fluid to.
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Old 1st August 2013, 10:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Definitely need to change pads when you change discs. As said above, the pads will be moulded to the original discs, and so won't perform anywhere near as good as it would with new pads.
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Old 1st August 2013, 10:27 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Sam, I'll be in a similar position shortly, and like you, it was caused by the runway event. What made you sway towards these as I know you were interested in the Performance Friction discs if you don't mind me asking?
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Old 1st August 2013, 10:30 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Having the same pads front and rear isn't that important for normal road use, but here is the purist theory:

If you are really pushing on the different compounds will have a different coefficient of friction (Mu) as the heat rises which may cause the brake bias to shift.
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Old 1st August 2013, 10:40 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Sam, I'll be in a similar position shortly, and like you, it was caused by the runway event. What made you sway towards these as I know you were interested in the Performance Friction discs if you don't mind me asking?
Couple of things mate. Heard many good reviews of the pagids. Good stopping power, not overly aggressive with lots of brake dust and relatively squeak free. The Alcon discs get good reviews too. I don't think for what I use the car for (a good hoon every now and again!) that I need the 400mm discs or the weight saving from the up rated bells. Cost is always a factor too. Got a wedding to save for as well as my 36 month service so don't want to go nuts! If I didn't have the monetary constraints to be honest I think I'd be going performance friction all round with pagids.
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Old 1st August 2013, 10:43 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Having the same pads front and rear isn't that important for normal road use, but here is the purist theory:

If you are really pushing on the different compounds will have a different coefficient of friction (Mu) as the heat rises which may cause the brake bias to shift.
Makes sense. Wouldn't have thought i push hard enough to notice that though!
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Old 1st August 2013, 11:16 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamboGrove View Post
Couple of things mate. Heard many good reviews of the pagids. Good stopping power, not overly aggressive with lots of brake dust and relatively squeak free. The Alcon discs get good reviews too. I don't think for what I use the car for (a good hoon every now and again!) that I need the 400mm discs or the weight saving from the up rated bells. Cost is always a factor too. Got a wedding to save for as well as my 36 month service so don't want to go nuts! If I didn't have the monetary constraints to be honest I think I'd be going performance friction all round with pagids.
Cheers Sam, much appreciated. Let us know your thoughts when you change.
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Old 1st August 2013, 11:26 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Ive just gone from the standard setup to Alcon 400mm discs all round (or what ever the alcon upgrade on the rear is) and also Pagid RS29 pads all round.

Love the setup, stopping power is much more improved, only downside is the bit of extra dust. I think I'll be moving to Carbotech pads once the Pagids are finished
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Old 1st August 2013, 11:54 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Ja5on View Post
Ive just gone from the standard setup to Alcon 400mm discs all round (or what ever the alcon upgrade on the rear is) and also Pagid RS29 pads all round.

Love the setup, stopping power is much more improved, only downside is the bit of extra dust. I think I'll be moving to Carbotech pads once the Pagids are finished
Make sure you've 'listened' to the carbotechs before you buy them mate.....the xp8s are very noises indeed!
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Old 1st August 2013, 11:55 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Ran XP8s and XP10s on my evo ;-)
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Old 2nd August 2013, 09:31 AM   #16 (permalink)
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i keep thinking alcom bbk but then i think for that price i can get a good set of brakes (AP, PF with pagids), gearbox cooler and anti roll bars

by the way how long should disks last compared to pads, im thinking 2 sets of pads for every set of disks?
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Old 2nd August 2013, 10:11 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ja5on View Post
Ive just gone from the standard setup to Alcon 400mm discs all round (or what ever the alcon upgrade on the rear is) and also Pagid RS29 pads all round.

Love the setup, stopping power is much more improved, only downside is the bit of extra dust. I think I'll be moving to Carbotech pads once the Pagids are finished
I've been on Alcon 400's, Pagids front and back but with stock rear rotors for some time now. The stopping is a huge improvement, eye bulging in comparison. Yep a bit dusty, occasional squeal when pulling up slowly. They seem to be wearing really well too.
I changed the fluid for Castrol perf stuff recently too, just because the pedal got a bit softer during a trackday.
I'd have thought the Alcon 380's up front with front and back pagids would be a huge improvement too.
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Old 5th August 2013, 01:46 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Just did TOTB boot camp, my front discs (standard) are showing small cracks around the drilled holes. Must have been the top end runs.
Can some one post a link\recomend a dealer for the alcons and Pagids.
are they different Pad types, is there a specific number.
Thanks
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Old 5th August 2013, 02:04 PM   #19 (permalink)
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me and eddie (arcam) changed mine , naaaaa to be honest eddie did, I stood and watched, made tea ect ect ect

Put the AP discs on, not the j hook ones the normal grooved ones they are less aggressive to pads.


The bigger discs will not make a massive amount of difference, but they are only 100 quid more if you fit them , its not a big job if you have done it before, but banging one of you fingers will not be good for you line of work I imagine .
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Old 6th August 2013, 11:00 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Sam irrespective of whether you go for Alcon/AP/PF front discs, if practical you should replace front and rear pads sets together if the pad compound you choose is a higher performance type.

As you know I ran with stock rear pads for a while as rear discs/pads were absolutely fine in terms thickness and pad material.
It wasn't a problem, but the improvement is immediately obvious when you do change them, in terms of pedal feel, overall stopping efficiency and bias - the difference is not subtle at all.

Do the lines and fluid for the moderate additional cost and don't forget the Ceratec for the pads.

Brakes were outstanding at Millbrook the other weekend, pedal was firm and consistent all day with great control, hitting threshold bang on every time. In contrast, pedal was to the floor with OEM setup during my previous visit after doing the 120 - 0 stops and fared little better on the handling circuit.

Colin made a point of asking what the setup was and commented on just how well he thought it performed. He mentioned it compared very well with the BBK, as that was more prone to locking up the rears; so more suited to out and out track use or where personal preference played a part.

If you want a hand changing discs and pads give me a shout, lines and fluids you'd have to have done as I don't have kit for that.

Paul: Jurgen sourced my Alcon fronts & pad set from Litchfield, plus the Goodridge lines; I bought the Pagid RS29's from Jamie at Evotune - worth a giving him a call as he knows them well.

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Last edited by Protegimus; 6th August 2013 at 11:08 PM..
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