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-   -   understeer (https://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/291418-understeer.html)

pulsarboby 25th August 2014 01:05 PM

understeer
 
been doing a fair few trackdays abroad lately and noticed now that the harder I push the car that they suffer from massive understeer which is really annoying.
ive increased front camber to -1.5 and have latest bilstein suspension fitted but still big understeer issues when pushed hard.
tried left foot braking and although that helps bring the car back it still slows you down

was chasing a gt3 porker round the gp nurburgring last week and from apex on bends I was having real troubles staying with him, on straights and long fast bends no problem but soon as you hit a bend with more curvature was understeer understeer soon as you tried coming back on the loud pedal

anyone got any ideas how to try irradicate this or is it something you just have to live with due to the weight of the car???

Voyager 25th August 2014 01:19 PM

its a fine line with the GTR a small amount of Understeer is going to be faster and safer than snap oversteer,
what tyre setup are you running ?
if your much wider at the back than at the front then either reduce rear width or increase front. try get all your braking over and done with before you enter the bend, the GTR is heavier than the porker so asking the tyres to deal with turning/traction and braking will get you an armful of understeer.

DODGY 25th August 2014 01:21 PM

Have a word with Jonny from JCRacing or Litchfield.

Graham

FLYNN 25th August 2014 01:28 PM

If you are understeering into a corner, your entry speed is too fast. If its a long sweeping corner and you start to understeer, a gentle left foot tap of the brakes will give some grip back to the front tyres so you can maintain your line

pulsarboby 25th August 2014 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voyager (Post 3088938)
its a fine line with the GTR a small amount of Understeer is going to be faster and safer than snap oversteer,
what tyre setup are you running ?
if your much wider at the back than at the front then either reduce rear width or increase front. try get all your braking over and done with before you enter the bend, the GTR is heavier than the porker so asking the tyres to deal with turning/traction and braking will get you an armful of understeer.


cheers fella but its really not minimal understeer, ive actually rolled the tyres where its almost taken the writing off at the top of sidewall. they are mpss and I did possibly wonder if this could be the issue.

tried spacers at rear as running 305s and 275 fronts but made no difference so removed them

ive almost another set of wheels (3 fronts and one rear lol) and was going to try running the oe dunlops as ive heard there a lot better on track, just need to find an odd rear wheel!

doing all the braking on entry then feeding on power to apex then hard on it from there after but that's when the troubles start which means the porker is getting away from me from apex and carrying more corner speed onto the straights which is most aggravating especially when I know the car is more than capable of staying with it if I can carry that extra bit of speed from the apex.

what kind of settings are you guys using that race or do a lot of track stuff?

pulsarboby 25th August 2014 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLYNN (Post 3088978)
If you are understeering into a corner, your entry speed is too fast. If its a long sweeping corner and you start to understeer, a gentle left foot tap of the brakes will give some grip back to the front tyres so you can maintain your line

nah its not understeering in Flynn its from apex coming out and yes left foot braking does help bring her back but still loses you ground if your chasing someone so trying to minimalise the understeer issue in first instance

Brad1979 25th August 2014 02:08 PM

Do the litchfield top arms sort this?

Blade 25th August 2014 02:34 PM

56 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad1979 (Post 3089066)
Do the litchfield top arms sort this?

Yes as does a stiffer sidewall, more camber and possibly a stiffer rear arb

Papa Smurf 25th August 2014 06:28 PM

Have you tried Toyo 888's as I suffered a similar but less dramatic problem with MPSS. The Litchfield suspension does help, but the Toyo's make one hell of a difference.

I do not want to get into the discussions of driving style, but any GT-R will understeer if pushed too hard into a corner - it is known as physics. I have driven the GP circuit quite a bit and found the car quite prone to understeer, whilst the same set up on the Ring is fine.

pulsarboby 26th August 2014 12:13 AM

^^^^^
Absolutely spot on fella
Yes my cars fine round the ring but truly bad on the gp circuit, and as you say if you push too hard going in then you will understeer at tightest point coming from apex and carry it through unless you keep left foot braking but that's not really ideal.

Think il give the dunlops a chance first but then if still there will switch to some 888s if you think that irradiates it a bit. Thought the pulsar gtir was bad for understeer but have to say the gtr is worse when it's really provoked but then it is 600kg heavier lol

Oh and I have uprated front and rear arbs already

ben15476 26th August 2014 10:03 AM

The MPSS's are crap on the track in the dry, they get too hot and squidgy.

Or loose some weight!

(from the car, not you, as that would be rude).

ants101 26th August 2014 01:26 PM

I have had a few sessions on the GP circuit this year and have significantly reduced my understeer by doing pretty much everything listed above....one thing I wanted to share is how much faster I could go while holding much tighter lines with VDC and standard traction set to off...with it on it just seems to want to push wide all the time...the Front new LSD helps pull out of the corners like a Front wheel drive car as long as you feed it on early and smoothly....IMHO there is a very narrow band with the GTR to keep it in the sweet spot and not understeer...

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulsarboby (Post 3091538)
^^^^^
Absolutely spot on fella
Yes my cars fine round the ring but truly bad on the gp circuit, and as you say if you push too hard going in then you will understeer at tightest point coming from apex and carry it through unless you keep left foot braking but that's not really ideal.

Think il give the dunlops a chance first but then if still there will switch to some 888s if you think that irradiates it a bit. Thought the pulsar gtir was bad for understeer but have to say the gtr is worse when it's really provoked but then it is 600kg heavier lol

Oh and I have uprated front and rear arbs already


Blade 26th August 2014 01:50 PM

56 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by ants101 (Post 3092842)
I have had a few sessions on the GP circuit this year and have significantly reduced my understeer by doing pretty much everything listed above....one thing I wanted to share is how much faster I could go while holding much tighter lines with VDC and standard traction set to off...with it on it just seems to want to push wide all the time...the Front new LSD helps pull out of the corners like a Front wheel drive car as long as you feed it on early and smoothly....IMHO there is a very narrow band with the GTR to keep it in the sweet spot and not understeer...

Ants - what front diff did you get and do you think it's worthwhile off track too?

ants101 26th August 2014 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blade (Post 3092994)
Ants - what front diff did you get and do you think it's worthwhile off track too?


Quaife......The steering is heavier and has a different feel so it may be something you want to try in another car first. You do get use to it quickly, it just feels weird at first. Will the 4WD clutch hold up...time will tell?

pulsarboby 26th August 2014 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ben15476 (Post 3092130)
The MPSS's are crap on the track in the dry, they get too hot and squidgy.

Or loose some weight!

(from the car, not you, as that would be rude).



haha yeah I could do with losing a bit of weight from me not the car :chuckle:

cheers for the replies guys and all the help
good point with traction off as could be tapping on the stoppers and making the car worse as you say

next time im on track il man up and ditch the traction altogether and couple that up with the oe dunlops to see if that combined helps with my troubles

if not il do as suggested and try a set of triple 8s on her
that's assuming cars not sold as someones just turned up to look at it :runaway:

FLYNN 26th August 2014 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulsarboby (Post 3093090)
haha yeah I could do with losing a bit of weight from me not the car :chuckle:

cheers for the replies guys and all the help
good point with traction off as could be tapping on the stoppers and making the car worse as you say

next time im on track il man up and ditch the traction altogether and couple that up with the oe dunlops to see if that combined helps with my troubles

if not il do as suggested and try a set of triple 8s on her
that's assuming cars not sold as someones just turned up to look at it :runaway:

I assumed you would have had the VCD turned OFF. Even in R mode, it is very intrusive.


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