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Old 12th August 2019, 09:49 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Thanks for all the comments and advice everyone. I am now leaving this thread. I will start a new one once I have some results to report.
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Old 12th August 2019, 05:01 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I regularly fill diving cylinders with Nitrox, pure O2, air and trimix (helium/nitrogen/O2). Releasing Nitrox or Air quickly from the cylinder will not result in a large temperature drop in the gas, but it will result in a large temperature drop of the vessel it's held in, i.e. the tank. The reverse is true when you fill the tank quickly, particularly with a thin gas like helium. The cylinder gets very hot and therefore we fill them in water tanks. I don't see how this is going to work personally...
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Old 12th August 2019, 05:33 PM   #23 (permalink)
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It’s called the Jules Thompson effect.
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Old 12th August 2019, 05:41 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Itís called the Jules Thompson effect.
You mean joule thomson effect .
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Old 12th August 2019, 05:42 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Joule-Thomson effect... ***x1f609; Yeah. Be careful with Nitrox too... If it's just a recreational dive shop filling it up, it'll unlikely be over 40%, but elevated oxygen fractions released under pressure can catch fire and explode. I wouldn't be spraying pressurised enriched air anywhere near an engine bay personally...
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Old 12th August 2019, 06:19 PM   #26 (permalink)
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You mean joule thomson effect .
Sorry spelling queen
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Old 12th August 2019, 08:10 PM   #27 (permalink)
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I'm back. The Dive Shop know exactly what I am planning and the Nitrox will be close to atmospheric o2 levels but greatly compressed. I am going to test it all first off the vehicle. If you think I'm a bit nutty, take a look at the Wizards of Nos Quick Fit Nitrous Kit: 12 oz bottle of nitrous and a propane/butane bottle with solenoid, activated by the headlight main beam. Not only that but it can be fitted in the engine bay but "Not for too long"!! Wtf
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Old 14th August 2019, 06:01 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Like the Alpha AMS fuel chiller diverting the air con. But LPG would rob Godzilla's power?
Not necessarily, it's well over 100 RON depending on its composition (wiki says 102-108) which means the lower calorific content per unit can be offset by running more aggressive timing.

The latent heat of vapourisation is 42800J/kg, so essentially every kg that changes from a liquid to a gas will absorb 42.8Kj of energy (ie remove that much heat from the surroundings).

Compare that to it's specific heat capacity of 1630J/KgK the same energy it absorbs in changing state would heat it by 26 degrees in a constant state.

It would be one huge project but an LPG powered turbo car using a modified vapouriser as a chargecooler would be a very interesting cooling solution.

It would be far more effective in particularly hot conditions too as you wouldn't be reliant on hot ambient air, the LPG would be absorbing the same heat (more or less) as you're transferring a significant proportion of the heat to the state change not to a temp change.
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Old 14th August 2019, 07:47 PM   #29 (permalink)
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I'm all for chemical enhancement of cars: methanol, ethanol, NOS, Co2, Nitrox; whether to add power or cool. I see propane injection is used for diesel performance but for petrol engines it only produces a small improvement in economy. Interesting point re cooling though I understand a big strong tank is required for propane.
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Old 15th August 2019, 09:25 AM   #30 (permalink)
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A 10lb cylinder would only last a few drag runs if you want to make a difference to IAT, you would need to hire a slave cylinder to decant from to even make this viable, the only use for a ntercooler spray is for drag or 1/2 or even a runway event and you would need to spray for the whole duration of the run.
Also make sure the CO2 is nowhere near your air filters.
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Old 15th August 2019, 10:20 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Agreed. I have experience with Nitrous on my previous car, a 2006 MGZTV8. Nitrous doesn't last long and is only good on a long straight, runway, autobahn or drag strip. The Co2 will only be used in short bursts when my Euctek dash shows high IAT etc. I have now moved to Nitrox as my local dive shop is helpful and fills are very cheap. Also, if any Nitrox did manage to drift from the intercooler to the large cone filters, it's very similar to atmospheric air; I won't be filling with enhanced Nitrox.
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Old 15th August 2019, 11:50 AM   #32 (permalink)
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I don't understand any of this!!

Seriously though, good to know those who are in the know are willing to share their knowledge
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Old 15th August 2019, 12:22 PM   #33 (permalink)
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I know a little and a little knowledge can be dangerous LOL
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Old 15th August 2019, 01:26 PM   #34 (permalink)
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I know a little and a little knowledge can be dangerous LOL
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Old 16th August 2019, 08:32 AM   #35 (permalink)
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If you have a decent intercooler you shouldnt be seeing hi temps when moving, my cooler on a 30 degree day at Brands 3 laps in it was 3 degrees over ambient, a quick squirt of Nitrox or co2 isnt going to achieve anything, however if you are sitting in staging lanes heat soaking the cooler then yes it will work but you need to freeze the cooler, I would expect to go through a few 10lb bottles in a day. As you know from drag racing you are not allowed a water spray system on track.What stage is your car and what hp do you think you will not lose by adding this system? It may be easier to just look at simpler methods of gaining power.
How cold do you think the Nitrox will be when it exits your spray bar? Because CO2 will be approx -80C.
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Old 16th August 2019, 10:59 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Hi, it's a 4.25 with a few additional bits including Ignition Projects coil packs, HKS plugs, Linney Flex Fuel Kit and AEM WMI. You may have done the Stage 4 last March 2018. The intercooler spray bar and water spray are inexpensive extras to aid cooling when driving a bit harder off road, or sitting in traffic. They will only be used occasionally. I may convert the Co2 big bottle to a 35 HP Nitrous dual shot later but only after the next remap and I will look at torque carefully first. I have upgraded circlips but no other gearbox (or engine) strengthening. I am now trying compressed air first on the intercooler sprayer and will measure IAT using my Ecutek bluetooth/software. Nos and Co2 may be more effective but I believe the expanding released air should also draw out heat?
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Old 16th August 2019, 12:13 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Hi, it's a 4.25 with a few additional bits including Ignition Projects coil packs, HKS plugs, Linney Flex Fuel Kit and AEM WMI. You may have done the Stage 4 last March 2018. The intercooler spray bar and water spray are inexpensive extras to aid cooling when driving a bit harder off road, or sitting in traffic. They will only be used occasionally. I may convert the Co2 big bottle to a 35 HP Nitrous dual shot later but only after the next remap and I will look at torque carefully first. I have upgraded circlips but no other gearbox (or engine) strengthening. I am now trying compressed air first on the intercooler sprayer and will measure IAT using my Ecutek bluetooth/software. Nos and Co2 may be more effective but I believe the expanding released air should also draw out heat?
Is this one Robbie from valet magic had done?
Im interested to see your findings on AIT between Nitrox/air and CO2, I can get the bottles filled with CO2 if you want to log that.
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Old 16th August 2019, 12:30 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Yes, via Robbie at VM. It's due back with Robbie this week for a while. I have several bottles (12 and 20oz) so a comparison would be a great idea. I have Nos, compressed air but not Co2 yet. If there is a good result I will use larger bottles. I'll chat with Robbie in the next 24 hours. Thanks for your interest.
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Old 16th August 2019, 02:03 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Yes, via Robbie at VM. It's due back with Robbie this week for a while. I have several bottles (12 and 20oz) so a comparison would be a great idea. I have Nos, compressed air but not Co2 yet. If there is a good result I will use larger bottles. I'll chat with Robbie in the next 24 hours. Thanks for your interest.
I would also log your fuel temps as this can also make a big difference, im going to run a little 12v cooler ive been playing with that I think will make a big difference.
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Old 16th August 2019, 08:35 PM   #40 (permalink)
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For future fitting I have a Mishimoto Race Radiator, 68 degree thermostat and transmission cooler; Derale power steering cooler and a small heatsink - possibly for the differential, as well as some ARC Cool Fins. In addition I have a Stillen brake cooling kit but have been advised against fitting it, so may use the two fans on some of the coolers; with the ducts repositioned. At the moment all my temps are good but with around 700ps and planning some track sessions, I am thinking of the future.
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