Co2 refills for intercooler spray bar - GT-R Register - Nissan Skyline and GT-R Drivers Club forum

Want to buy a banner ad? Find out more here.

Go Back   GT-R Register - Nissan Skyline and GT-R Drivers Club forum > General > General Nissan R35 GT-R Chat
Register Garage FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Insurance


Like Tree2Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 7th August 2019, 09:04 PM   #1 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Co2 refills for intercooler spray bar

Anyone know any supplier in/near Berkshire where I can have bottles and small cylinders refilled with Co2? I have a Cryo2 intercooler spray system and some paintball gun gas bottles. I've tried welders, building supplies, medical gas, garages and gun shops!
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2019, 08:14 AM   #2 (permalink)
Crick is Appreciating evenly spaced cable ties
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 204
Hi Phil

I'm not from Berkshire but but how about trying :

- fire extinguisher/fire companies
- garden centres (used for aquatic plants)
- Aquariam/pond/fisheries
- Gas bottle suppliers (like BOC etc)

Just thinking out loud while I drink my morning coffee
__________________
Crick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2019, 09:28 AM   #3 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Thanks. I'm trying them all. Unfortunately most want to supply a rental bottle or cylinder. I'm now looking at transferring from a large cylinder to my bottles then returning the cylinder to get the deposit back. I have 10oz and 20oz paintball bottles for the car and a 10lb cylinder. The latter would be boot mounted for nitrous or Co2 usually but as Co2 would only be used infrequently to spray the intercooler before or after the track, I may use it as the donor/storage. Just have to find someone who just refills ***x1f609;
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 8th August 2019, 09:58 AM   #4 (permalink)
barry P. is fed up with all the politics and back stabbing in car clubs!
GT-RDC Founder Member
 
barry P.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: On a race track
Cars owned: GT-R R35, Evo IX GT, Evo II, Radical SR3, and a "Dancing Donkey".
Posts: 3,200
The CO2 will only cool for a few seconds, ok for a drag run but a waste of time for any other track work. You might as well give the intercooler a quick blast from a CO2 fire extinguisher, it will probably be more effective.
__________________


"Welcome my son, welcome to the machine."
barry P. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2019, 10:23 AM   #5 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Also have an intercooler water spray with additives, like the old Scooby and Evo ones. The Co2 and water work together on the intercooler. Obviously it will only work for a short while but is inexpensive. My AEM WMI kit is now working well above 10 psi of boost. I will be trying some E85 (VP E85 X) later this year; as I have a Linney Flex Fuel Kit, uprated 330 pumps, 1050 injectors, HKS Fire plugs and Ignition Projects coil packs. On a stage 4.25 my current map is maximum 700ps on 99 octane. Not sure whether the turbos are now at the limit, or whether the E85 will increase by at least 10% on the stock turbos as the fuel will be far better? Also, Turbosmart wastewater, Linney 60mm suction pipes and a few other goodies to go on. Will have to see what it does on the dyno and may have to cap the torque for the standard gearbox (circlips uprated, valve clean and new fluids 1500 miles ago). It's a late 2014/64.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2019, 10:25 AM   #6 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Don't you hate predictive text: Turbosmart Wastegates not "wastewater" !!!
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2019, 10:04 PM   #7 (permalink)
borat52 is unaware they can edit their status
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,154
Just talking intercoolers in general here, as long as your cooling air into the intercooler is not obstructed and flowing fast enough the intercooler shouldn't need any assistance so relatively high speed load can be cooled effectively.

So the problem really relates to how to provide adequate cooling with low airflow (the higher the ambient temp the higher that low airflow number will be).

Given it's not a constant requirement would it be possible to somehow plumb the aircon into an insulated water tank and then somehow use that cold water to absorb the heat from the intercooler in low flow conditions, just open the circuit under certain temp/airflow/load conditions).

It's all theoretical until you actually run the numbers on how much energy an AC system can remove from water and how much heat you need removing from the intercooler but if it is in any where near close it would be sustainable.
__________________
borat52 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th August 2019, 11:13 PM   #8 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
AMS, DEI and others produce fuel chillers/coolers; the AMS one actually diverts the air con system. I saw a documentary last night about the SAS rigging DIY condensers for Jeep radiators in the desert. The WMI is called chemical intercooling by some, as it takes heat out of the fuel charge in the inlet thus reducing knock.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th August 2019, 05:33 PM   #9 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Found a supplier at last. Everyone wanted to rent me a Co2 cylinder and whinge about connecting the tank. However Divecrew in Crowthorne were really helpful and will fill any sized legal bottle or cylinder. It will be a Nitrox diving mixture i.e. compressed air with a bit more oxygen. The important bit is that as it exits and goes through the spray bar it will be very cold on changing back to gas. Nitrox is similar to air and not far from Nitrous. It's really cheap and if any gets in the cone filters (modified) it will have little or no adverse effect, unlike Co2. The additional cooling will be used before a run or when stationary to additionally cool the charge.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th August 2019, 06:06 PM   #10 (permalink)
barry P. is fed up with all the politics and back stabbing in car clubs!
GT-RDC Founder Member
 
barry P.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: On a race track
Cars owned: GT-R R35, Evo IX GT, Evo II, Radical SR3, and a "Dancing Donkey".
Posts: 3,200
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilEvans64 View Post
Found a supplier at last. Everyone wanted to rent me a Co2 cylinder and whinge about connecting the tank. However Divecrew in Crowthorne were really helpful and will fill any sized legal bottle or cylinder. It will be a Nitrox diving mixture i.e. compressed air with a bit more oxygen. The important bit is that as it exits and goes through the spray bar it will be very cold on changing back to gas. Nitrox is similar to air and not far from Nitrous. It's really cheap and if any gets in the cone filters (modified) it will have little or no adverse effect, unlike Co2. The additional cooling will be used before a run or when stationary to additionally cool the charge.
Isnít it still a gas when its in dive bottles, just compressed to a very high pressure,so it will drop a bit in temp as it expands but nothing like solid CO2 which is changing two states from a solid to a gas in a very short time which gives a big temp change.
If nitrox had a big temp change it would freeze divers lungs when they breathed in through the regulator.
__________________


"Welcome my son, welcome to the machine."
barry P. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th August 2019, 08:13 PM   #11 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
I'm no chemist but apparently the brass regulator and metered Nitrox used by most divers allows the gas to be warmed up enough to be comfortable to breathe. I think the Co2 and Nitrox will both be liquid and cold when compressed. Not sure whether Co2 or Nitrous will be much colder than Nitrox however there will be enough of a temperature drop to further cool the intake charge air. I have the Ecutek bluetooth software, so once it's all installed I will check the IAT and other stats.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th August 2019, 10:37 AM   #12 (permalink)
charles charlie is chasing a Veyron from 30-130mph
GT-RDC Member
 
charles charlie's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: North West
Cars owned: E36 M3 Evo, Mini Cooper S, 996 Boxster S, Caterham Super 7, Merc Tractor :(
Posts: 7,609
CO2 will be liquid in your tanks above 5.2bar (75psi) and below 31.1 įc ambient temp. Also when released that CO2 will be around -80 įc.

No doubt when fitted correctly to provide maximum IC coverage this will be effective but for only a v short time as your supply will be size limited.
__________________
Arrived 29/5/09 Reborn 12/1/17
______________________________________


Engine built @ RiversideRacing
Litcho rods/pistons/RaceIC/BOVs/oil cooler/susp+handling kit/front diff
Race Developments ported manifold/AT Power TBs
RF street zorst+DPs
RacingBrake BBK
Xtreme18 Clutch/Dodson 1st gear+shaft/trans brace
2015 alloys/nav upgrade/Nismo cluster
DSC susp controller
DBA front/Varis CF bonnet/2016 Lights
TTE7XX turbos = >900bhp 700lbsft 30-130mph in 8.19s



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
charles charlie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th August 2019, 01:13 PM   #13 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Yep, lovely and cold for occasional bursts. I have different sized bottles: 12oz, 20oz and even a 10lb cylinder. The latter would be boot mounted but not fitting it yet. I also have a nitrous conversion kit and may use that one day with the 10lb cylinder but only a couple of 35 or 50 Bhp jets. Japanese tuners are using the specific NX kit with throttle body spacers.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th August 2019, 09:02 PM   #14 (permalink)
borat52 is unaware they can edit their status
GTR.co.uk seasoned Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,154
Just thinking outside of the box, LPG systems actually have to heat up the LPG entering the injectors due to the same property above of changing state from a liquid to a gas.

If a car was running LPG you have your cooler right there and the more load you place on the fuelling the more heat you can absorb. So you'd want a chargecooler plumbed into the LPG vapouriser.
__________________
borat52 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th August 2019, 10:19 PM   #15 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Like the Alpha AMS fuel chiller diverting the air con. But LPG would rob Godzilla's power?
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th August 2019, 06:37 AM   #16 (permalink)
matt j is at Strawberry Racing
Following EJH#25
 
matt j's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 6,812
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilEvans64 View Post
10lb cylinder. The latter would be boot mounted but not fitting it yet.
Itís dangerous enough having nitrous inside the car but youíd have to be either suicidal or pretty ****ing stupid to mount a 10lb CO2 cylinder inside your car! (IMHO obvs)
__________________
matt j is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th August 2019, 07:13 AM   #17 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
Nitrous cylinders of many sizes are common in tuned US and Japanese cars. Large ones are usually in the boot. They have blow off valves and are very strong. Don't really see a massive difference to LPG or even 65+ litres of petrol. Though Co2, nitrous and Nitrox are not as dangerous as petrol. Some modified cars have a couple of 10lb bottles behind the front seats - that really is nutty.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th August 2019, 07:20 AM   #18 (permalink)
matt j is at Strawberry Racing
Following EJH#25
 
matt j's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 6,812
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilEvans64 View Post
Though Co2, nitrous and Nitrox are not as dangerous as petrol.
You are joking right?
I think youíre confusing the other properties with flammability.
__________________
matt j is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th August 2019, 07:44 AM   #19 (permalink)
PhilEvans64 is unaware they can edit their status
GT-RDC Member
 
PhilEvans64's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 80
As long it's mounted securely and in an area where it won't be breathed in if a bottle did fail, I can't see any issues. Petrol, hydrogen, LPG, methanol etc are all used in various cars under safe handling conditions. A bit of NOS, co2 or Nitrox, for cooling should be ok. Anyway perhaps the thread is going a bit off topic. I will provide an update once it's all working.
__________________
PhilEvans64 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th August 2019, 09:31 AM   #20 (permalink)
matt j is at Strawberry Racing
Following EJH#25
 
matt j's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 6,812
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilEvans64 View Post
As long it's mounted securely and in an area where it won't be breathed in if a bottle did fail, I can't see any issues. Petrol, hydrogen, LPG, methanol etc are all used in various cars under safe handling conditions. A bit of NOS, co2 or Nitrox, for cooling should be ok. Anyway perhaps the thread is going a bit off topic. I will provide an update once it's all working.
How do you detect a CO2 leak if youíre driving?
The point Iím making is, being in the petrochemical industry, CO2 and Nitrogen are considered 2 of the most dangerous gases, not Petrol or any other flammable substance.
__________________
matt j is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 02:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
http://www.Tyreforums.com

tyreforums

 

Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.