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GTR Failure in outside lane

13K views 54 replies 25 participants last post by  Tinoush 
#1 ·
Help!

What happened;
I drove my GTR today and after about 30 minutes, the TPMS warning light came on, reporting an error and that the car should be taken to a dealer. After calming down that this wasn't a flat tyre warning, I continued the journey for a few more minutes and then I lost all electrical power. All the ignition lights, MFD display, radio, lights etc died on me. The engine was still running at this point and I managed to move the car across three lanes to the hard shoulder. When I had completely stopped and taken the car out of drive, the engine stopped aswell.

Some diagnosis;
I checked for any fuses that might have blown, both in the footwell and under the bonnet, but couldn't see any obvious culprits. Then I rang the RAC and got a flatbed booked to come and pick me up and notified the motorway police patrols of my location. The lights then came on again without any prompting from me, so I started the car. After about 30 seconds, the lights went out again, but the engine stayed running (with the gearstick in Park mode). I tried to turn the engine off, but couldnt - the ignition wasn't responding. I tried putting the keyfob in the slot under the steering column, but it made no difference. After about 5 minures, the engine died aswell, but the windscreen wipers stayed on and couldnt be switched off either. Eventually the wipers stopped as the battery ran out of power (about an hour after the engine died - still sat on the hard shoulder in the snow at this point). A while later the lights on the ignition came on again and I managed to put the hazards on.

Now the interesting bit;
I lifted the passenger floor cover up, where the towing hook is stored and found half a pint of water in the polystyrene molded well. I could see that the water had found its way down the side of the passenger footwell, from the bulkhead, to get into the well. This probably explains the failing electrics which worked intermittently afterwards. I was driving in wet conditions and the water wasnt there the last time I drove the car on Monday.

Any ideas ?
What will the water have short circuited and what should I be worried about ?!
The car was with Nissan all week being serviced and I collected the car on Friday (it was a G2 36 month service) and I havent driven the car since then until today. Will they have had to move anything that could have affected the grommet/hole that was letting in water ?!

I've driven the car in a lot wetter weather than this in the last 4 months and never had an issue with water ingress.

All feedback gratefully received!
 
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#4 ·
Hi mate. Bad times. Contact Charles Charlie on here as he's a bit of a whiz with the electrics on the car so may be able to point a few things out that could help. I know it doesn't help, but you'll read many times on here that most owners don't take their cars to NHPC's as most can be right cowboys, whereas the independents know the cars inside out better than anyone, so know what issues removing something could result in, but obviously I understand if your car is under warranty you would go to NHPC.
Good luck mate and hope it gets sorted.....I'd have had my heart in my mouth if that happened to me. Think I might check the passenger footwell of mine :eek:
 
#6 ·
Does sound like something has short circuited... best let the HPC check it out. What MY is your GTR by the way? I've been noticing some pretty common failures such as steering lock, dial bulbs failing and also water in the footwell.
 
#8 ·
Sounds like water entered the cabin through the ridiculously positioned grommet in the passenger side firewall, and flowed over the BCM module which is located on the outer side of that footwell.

All your symptoms can be attributed to the BCM being shorted. It detects and controls everything from gear stick position to headlights, indicators and ignition button.

Dealer needs to hook up a consult III and just check the BCM isn't ****ed.
 
#9 ·
Thank you!

Thanks for your support folks, really appreciate it.:thumbsup:

Glennyboy:
I'm trying to remain optimistic about my local NHPC, but I think you may be right. I took my car to be serviced by them, because its under warranty still and was due a free optimisation. I hope the damage is minimal and fixed quickly. Whether it was caused by anything they did during the service, will remain a mystery - I only know I've not had the problem previously when driving in worse conditions for longer. I cant think they would have needed to remove the battery though.

GTR RGT, saucyboy:
I saw the shield from AMS and I'm starting to regret not buying one. With hindsight.....Arse :(

sw20GTS:
I'm hoping its purely a short circuit as well. The RAC patrol man disconnected the battery for me, explaining that he'd seen some strange and potentially dangerous side affects of similar incidents. As long as the water that got in, doesn't freeze and cause more damage, I'm hoping its simply a matter of drying the car out, charging the battery and fixing the crappy rubber grommet. The battery will need charging again which will no doubt result in some kind of GTR tax :(

Charles:
Thanks for responding and I didn't realise what the BCM module was or where it was located until you mentioned it. Not sure how expensive a replacement will be if its not repairable, but hoping this will be covered under warranty anyway. It does sound like it's the BCM that's been shorted though. Thanks again for your advice.:clap:
 
#14 · (Edited)
The grommet is actually shown quite well in this post;

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/167390-r35-endless-hood-bonnet-canceller-installation.html#post1657678

I've read that other forum members have removed the battery and then sealed the bulkhead hole with a decent sealant to circumvent the issue. I'll wait to see the response I get from the NHPC tomorrow and see what the options are from there. If Nissan do fix the grommet, it will be interesting to see what their solution is.

The BCM module that Charles mentioned is also shown in this picture;

http://www.speedforsale.com/staff/files/iPodConverterInstall.pdf
 
#20 ·
Chopchopsee - Can I suggest you take a look at the carpet around the passenger footwell and check if its damp - the quote I'm getting from Nissan to replace the BCM and PCM which been soaked in water, is;

£2,500 just for the parts !!!!!!!!!!!!

And its now been suggested that the wiring loom may need to be replaced, as the connectors have corroded. And they are quoting;

£5,500 for the wiring loom, plus labour !!!!!!!!!

At the moment I've got a very expensive skip with a GTR badge on the back.

:mad::bawling::puke:
 
#23 ·
If the terminals on the end of the plug silver they will be ok.
This is just a dealer going over the top as usual.
WD 40 sprayed on the connections and plugged in and out four or five times would clean the connections in seconds.
Might be a idea to source a second hand ECU. there was a place in wimbledon many tears ago used to refurb ECUs.
Hope this helps Goldie
 
#24 ·
Sorry to hear about your situation W4rpd.

The really, really, irritating thing about situations like these is that you have absolutely no way of telling whether the HPC disturbed the grommet when carrying out the work on your car. Add to that the fact that it's in a stupid position that appears to be almost directly above the where the BCM is mounted and you have to conclude it's absolutely nothing to do you with you. And yet you might still get slapped with an enormous bill at the end of this. Let's hope that doesn't happen.

I'm surprised that there's not been more noise about this on the UK forum before though. I would have thought that if the grommet was not doing its job (if left undisturbed) there would have been many more reported incidents of the same problem. Has your car had any previous work done that would have entailed additional wiring running through that grommet?

I guess all of us with early cars are now sat waiting for this to happen and will be bricking it every time we drive in the rain until we get round to caulking up the grommet.

Good luck with your discussions with Nissan.
 
#28 ·
Thank you to everyone on here

Updates;

I have now lodged a case with Nissan Customer Services to try and sort through warranty. Westway Oxford HPC have stated that Nissan will not entertain a warranty claim, as they dont believe there is a fault. They wont even send an inspector out to view the damage. Its slightly more complicated than initially reported, because Nissan are stating that because I have had the BDL front and rear camera kit installed, which has the flat cables going through the same grommet, this has caused the leak.

However, I have found and forwarded evidence from many people from Europe and the US who have had the same issue without any other cables being routed through the grommet. I have also forwarded the details for the AMS shield which has been developed because of the demand for a solution to the problem. I believe there are Nissan instructions to wire up the aftermarket Nissan DRL's passing cable through the grommet (in other words its the recommended route) and I'm looking for this in parallel.

Nissan have quoted over £12k to replace the main wiring harness, the short harness and potentially the BCM and PCM module if these needed replacing. I don't think they need replacing, but can't tell until they wire the car backup.

I have an alternative plan to resolve this, but its inappropriate for me to disclose until I have a final answer from Nissan. I have experience of resolving this kind of issue through legal means, but its not a route to undertake unless absolutely necessary.

Thank you;
The feedback from helpful individuals on this forum is immense. The supportive comments from people who have replied to this thread is really really appreciated - its pretty stressful to have spent a small fortune on a 2010 car 6 months ago, which still has another 6 months of Nissan warranty remaining and has only covered 11k miles, to be told that I should spend another £12k+ on fixing an issue not under warranty. And I'd only had the car back for 48 hours after spending £800 on a service.

Once I have a conclusion from Nissan, I will post photos, correspondance etc as I believe other GTR owners should be aware of the issue and should mitigate themselves.

BUT - If you have condensation in your car, if you have slightly damp carpets in the passenger footwell, if you have any other cables going through the grommet behind the battery other than the main wiring loom - seal the grommet yourself now. Its prone to leaking under heavy rain, as water trickles down the side of the wiring loom. Over time this will corrode connectors or worse.

And if you have any of these symptoms, please let me know - because it will help support my case in getting Nissan to fix under warranty!

Thank you folks.
 
#30 ·
Updates;

I have now lodged a case with Nissan Customer Services to try and sort through warranty. Westway Oxford HPC have stated that Nissan will not entertain a warranty claim, as they dont believe there is a fault. They wont even send an inspector out to view the damage. Its slightly more complicated than initially reported, because Nissan are stating that because I have had the BDL front and rear camera kit installed, which has the flat cables going through the same grommet, this has caused the leak.

However, I have found and forwarded evidence from many people from Europe and the US who have had the same issue without any other cables being routed through the grommet. I have also forwarded the details for the AMS shield which has been developed because of the demand for a solution to the problem. I believe there are Nissan instructions to wire up the aftermarket Nissan DRL's passing cable through the grommet (in other words its the recommended route) and I'm looking for this in parallel.

Nissan have quoted over £12k to replace the main wiring harness, the short harness and potentially the BCM and PCM module if these needed replacing. I don't think they need replacing, but can't tell until they wire the car backup.

I have an alternative plan to resolve this, but its inappropriate for me to disclose until I have a final answer from Nissan. I have experience of resolving this kind of issue through legal means, but its not a route to undertake unless absolutely necessary.

Thank you;
The feedback from helpful individuals on this forum is immense. The supportive comments from people who have replied to this thread is really really appreciated - its pretty stressful to have spent a small fortune on a 2010 car 6 months ago, which still has another 6 months of Nissan warranty remaining and has only covered 11k miles, to be told that I should spend another £12k+ on fixing an issue not under warranty. And I'd only had the car back for 48 hours after spending £800 on a service.

Once I have a conclusion from Nissan, I will post photos, correspondance etc as I believe other GTR owners should be aware of the issue and should mitigate themselves.

BUT - If you have condensation in your car, if you have slightly damp carpets in the passenger footwell, if you have any other cables going through the grommet behind the battery other than the main wiring loom - seal the grommet yourself now. Its prone to leaking under heavy rain, as water trickles down the side of the wiring loom. Over time this will corrode connectors or worse.

And if you have any of these symptoms, please let me know - because it will help support my case in getting Nissan to fix under warranty!

Thank you folks.

Real shame that they keep taking such a cheap attitude to these incidents

No matter how much I love the car, the principle of their behaviour makes me much more likely to sell the car earlier than I otherwise would . . .

Hopefully a reasonable resolution can be achieved for you - good luck
 
#29 ·
I hope it all goes well w4rpd and nissan help you out. Really gutted for you mate.

Satan, really nice to see forum members helping out other members, kudos to you mate.

It's a breath of fresh air, members helping out other members after all the recent incidents that have occurred.

RJJ
 
#34 · (Edited)
RJJ

Thanks. That is the whole point of a forum surely isn't it?:thumbsup:

Just look at what "Super Sanj" as I now call him and "Honda_Pilot" have done for other forum members.

We all have the same beast and we all benefit from the collective knowledge and some of the specalist knowledge that we have on here.

I absolutely HATE to see anyone get shafted. £12K my fu**in arse. My real worry is that if the car is left too long at the stealer, or played about with, it will require major work.

I am sure with CC's knowledge and the mechanic who tends the fleet of vehicles for the company I work for, this will be sorted for a fraction of the cost quoted.

I am happy to do what I can to assist, and have PM'D W4RPD with my number.

We will see if this can't get fixed at my kind of money.:thumbsup:
 
#31 ·
W4RPED, as has been said in this thread, I'd take the HPCs assessment with a pinch of salt. If the BCM dries out and works, why on earth replace everything, that's just nuts and over egging the problem to get some big money work out of the warranty.

My feeling is that much of the warranty decision is based on Nissan trying to mitigate the expenses brought to them by their HPCs.

Either way, there is no way I'll let you spunk 12k on this.

Not on my watch!
 
#32 ·
Hope you get this sorted buddy :thumbsup:

I'm concerned about mine as i do sometimes seem to have excessive condensation in my car and have to sit with the blowers on for a few minutes before driving off.

Does anybody have a picture of this grommet and where to find it so i can check it out?
 
#39 ·
Sam you can see it in the link posted early in this thread to the pop up bonnet canceller install guide. It's about 6 or 7 photos down into that thread once battery has been removed. That thread also gives good instructions on battery removal. Might have a crack at it this weekend and break out the duct tape and caulk. Or maybe I'll bottle it in case I mess something else up ...
 
#35 ·
The easiest way to see it is to grab a torch, get on your hand and knees and look up behind the glove box from the passenger footwell. It's about 10-12 inches up and towards the exterior side of that footwell. The grommet on my car is about an inch wide.
 
#40 ·
I never sealed mine as the torrential water ingress only happened the once in horrendous conditions on the M6 years ago. The missus got wet feet but all else was okay.

If memory serves the metalwork around it is smooth but I can't remember how good access is from inside as it was ages ago when I was looking for an easy route into the cabin for a long forgotten project.

If access from inside is tricky, you'd have to remove the battery and access it from there, and that's a tight squeeze.

If it wasn't so bloody cold I'd nip out and take a ganzy but I'm staying inside where it's warm.....
 
#41 ·
Guys, I know it's been said before, but Satan and CC you are effing legends supporting the poor lad whose trying to be fleeced of 12k. If it happened to me I'd by pooing myself at the thought of how much it would cost. Having guys like you, and many others on this forum who are always around to help and offer support and advice seriously makes a huge difference. It's easy to say nothing as its not your problem, but what you've done to support and potentially help here makes such a difference and helps people sleep at night knowing they're not in it alone with these cars. :bowdown1: I thank you, and good luck to W4RPD getting this all sorted. We'll all be watching this space..
 
#42 ·
Are the members with condensation and damp in their cars keeping them in a garage or leaving it outside in all weathers?

Just interested to see if this is a issue whilst driving the car or if it could be water working its way into the car from being left outside.
 
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