[Fuggles]

BBC1 will be showing Watchdog special on Wednesday 25 July. I'm not sure of the content in detail but understand it will deal with stolen Japanese cars that eventaully find themselves in the UK. Might be worth watching. Unfortuantely there's not much on the BBC website other than;

"In a Watchdog Special Investigation that spans the globe, Quentin Willson reveals the biggest car fraud in the world and exposes the international criminals behind it."

 

[stu]

Stolen imports

Fuggles,

Had a lot of emails/phones calls today about this program. I believe various members of the register have had problems with buying (unintentionally!) stolen cars. I imported my car through an agent last year - how do you know if its stolen or not?

 

[tykes]

Stolen Imports

Stu,

The BBC world service ran the article today here in Singapore.

As one who unwittingly purchased a stolen car in Dubai and had it seized back in UK I have some first hand experience. As some know I was lucky in that I got my money back and then managed to trace the owner in Japan and got the car as well.

The only way of checking in the UK if a car is stolen is to find a friendly policeman who has access to the Interpol database where all stolen cars from Japan are listed. The Customs people do not check when the cars come into the country. It is when you apply for registration that the VRO ask for the car to be inspected by the police by which time they have already checked the chassis number against the Interpol lists. Some police forces are more stringent than others and Hampshire are particularly hot.

Inspections only started at the beginning of last year so it is possible that a number of cars on the roads in UK today, that came into the country before this, are actually stolen but the owners just dont know. The traffic cop in Hampshire who took my car told me that he made a point of stopping cars that he believed were imports just to get the details of chassis numbers etc. If the car turned out to be stolen then he would seize it.

A bit of a Catch22 as if you want to be sure and check against the Interpol list there is alays a chance that it might be stolen and you could lose it. It took me the best part of 9 months to trace the owner/insurance company in Japan but it was worth it because I got the car back for a song! I have the contacts now so could do it again. I was actually in Dubai the other day and was offered 2 R34 virtually brand new for 16K each!! I am tempted to trace the Japanese insurers to see if I can acquire title and then buy the car from Dubai knowing that I own it legally.

The Dubai market sent hundreds (thousands?) of cars of all sorts to the UK over the last 2 years - GTRs, Evos, Aristos, Land Cruisers, Prados etc. If you watch the Blackbushe auction news they have sales of recovered cars every so often including GTRs. Buying from there might be cheap and you legally own the car but you will have no history whatsoever.

I've waffled on a bit here!!!

Richard

 

[Charlie]

You guys down south get the good programs
Up here BBC1 7:30 Wednesday
'Match Of The Day'.......bl##dy football!!!!!

 

[YETI]

Yer right there Charlie, no one wants to see some bloody foreigners (Rangers) playing some other bloody foreigners. Poor show BBC1 Scotland. (Maybe it's because we have such a low car crime rate)

 

[stu]

Interpol

Tykes,

Thanks for the advice. I know a traffic cop (always helps, especially with my right foot!) so will cadge a favour off him. Not sure I want to though....

Charlie/YetI,

Spent '91 - '00 in Aberdeen and I'd forgotten how shite the TV was up there! Saying that last night's wee show was more of a 'horror' than a 'must see'.

 

[Fuggles]

Stolen GTRs list

We can get a complete list of all the stolen GTRs. A contact in the Met Vehicle Crme Squad has said he wil provide us a list if we make a formal application through the owners club. Once we have the list we can then check without having to declare it to the police.

If anyone is interested I guess it will need to be done "officially" through the owners club (whatever that means).

John

 

[JasonO]

Did anyone video this program ??

It'd be nice to get a copy to pass around up here.

 

[tykes]

Stolen GTR's

John,

Are you talking a list of all stolen GTR's or just those stolen in the UK?? If they are talking the Interpol list then that would be useful.

Richard

 

[Fuggles]

Video

Jason,

Do you need it with subtitles?

 

[tim at svs]

video

I video'd it last night on a VHS half tape speed machine. Havent watched it yet so just in case I recorded Coronation St by accident I will check later and let you know tomorrow. so how do we contact Interpol ? Damned if I am spending £25+vat to find out via a main dealer. This business should have all been sorted at the time of import. Last night on the radio they were running up to the program saying vehicles had been 'secretly' imported. What bollocks , what did they do bring them in on a raft under the cover of darkness ? No I think not,they all must have cleared through customs, some have had SVA tests and so on. As usual its us the consumers paying for what Officer dibble should have sorted out in the first place.Tim

 

[stu]

Official list

John,

An 'official' list sounds good to me. I'd rather not have to declare if I didn't have to. Only 1 point, you're talking about a 'GTR' list. I may only have a minor GTS-25T but I'd be niave to assume it wasn't stolen and I'll be buggered if I'm going to pay my local Nissan garage £25 - they've ripped me off enough already.

 

[SteveC]

thieving bastards

This problem should have been addressed in Japan where they came out of the country, can you imagine how hard it must be to track a stolen car with dodgy VIN plates through 3 different countries. Japan--> UAE ---> Ireland ---> England

At the end of the day if the car has no paperwork with it then it shouldn't be allowed onto the freighter in the port. But if the scale the police believe to be true then this problem is enormous and most of us could concieveably be driving someone else's car.

Was/is the poor guy who had his Skyline taken away on national TV a member of this forum ? He looked totally choked If you read this, I hope you can get some compensation...

£25 plus VAT seems a bit steep for the dealer (who I bought my car from) to tell me if it is rightfully mine.

if it is that profitable then perhaps we should start up a little ringing operation......hhhhmmmm (joking)

/Steve

 

[stu]

Paperwork

What paperwork were we meant to get when we imported?

(Not that I'm worried or anything)



Full info from the program last night can be found at the BBC website:

www.bbc.co.uk/watchdog/guides_to/gt_carfraud1.shtml

 

[SteveC]

history

Some history would have been nice with the previous keepers identity much like our registration documents.

Can you let us know what we need to provide to get our precious motors checked out?

I would have thought that security would have to surround this exercise as if we go posting our vin plates all over the web it is asking to get your car cloned !! if it isn't already

cheers
Steve

 

[stu]

Checking it out

Steve,

Took this from the BBC website. Hope it helps.If you believe that your car could be at risk:

Take it to the nearest appropriate dealer along with the V5 registration document, and for a fee of £25 (plus VAT), they'll check your car's VIN number against their database in Japan. Please do not ring the police or manufacturers at this stage, as your car must be examined first. If you do ring either of them you will only be referred back to the web site or watchdog help line.

The result of the inspection will then be sent to you, the registered keeper, and a copy of the inspection result will also be sent to the police responsible for the area where the registered keeper lives.

If your car's details agree with the manufacturer's Japanese data, then you have the option of contacting the police (ask for your local Stolen Vehicle Squad), to have your car checked against an outstanding international stolen vehicle database. It is essential that your vehicle is examined by a dealer first, otherwise the you may be asking the police to check the wrong V.I.N. number.

If the details do not agree with the manufacturer's Japanese data, then you have the option of taking your car to the police to have the VIN plate and chassis number examined to see if it may have been tampered with. The police should be able to tell you if your car has been stolen, and may then be able to trace the original owner in Japan. If they can confirm that your car has been stolen and also establish the identity of the original owner, then there is a risk you may have your car seized and possibly sold. You should seek advice from your solicitor.

If the details don't agree with the Japanese manufacturer's data on year of build, it could be that your car hasn't been stolen, but simply had its year changed to make it appear newer than it is. You should contact the seller and threaten legal proceedings for misrepresentation, but also contact the DVLA who will supply the correct registration mark for the car's true year of manufacture.

To contact the DVLA please call 0870 2400 010
or write to DVLA, Swansea, SA99 1AR

 

[Charlie]

So who's going to be first in following Quentin's advice.... by telling the police what your VIN is to find out if its nicked......

 

[davewilkins]

Image

Agreed. No one is going to buy my car in the future unless I can prove that it is not stolen!

 

[SteveC]

list ?

Perhaps if the list of stolen cars is submitted then we can compare to our numbers but it looks like the vin plates were changed/chassis numbers altered, and unless you know what you are looking for you wont be able to tell, I know for a fact that when I look at a car I couldn't tell if it had been altered.

Guy is indeed right though if this is handled badly then the re sale value of our cars will be severely affected by this.

/steve

 

[tykes]

Stolen Cars

All,

My car was in custody for 9 months with Hampshire Police and I had to pay 4.5 grand!!! in storage charges - it was parked in a garage in Hampshire and they did not even keep it clean!!

During that time the police made absolutely no progress in finding the owners/insurers in Japan so I did it myself. Interestingly the guy who helped me was involved in the TV programme (Andy Worseley) and Gerry Dawson/ Steve Shaw of Hants police car crime unit.

I believe the guy with the blue R33 in the film was an actor but my son who watched it thought it was my car!!

There was some mention that Japanese insurers are interested in getting the cars back. I do not believe this is the case as when I finally tracked down the insurers of my car they were only too willing to negotiate and as I have said before I got the car for a song. I should say that I am in the insurance business although my speciality is Boeing 747's and the like.

One of the problems in identifying stolen cars is the quality of the ringing coming out of Dubai. They have original Nissan VIN plates with new (false) numbers on them. For 1500 quid they will change the colour of a car including the paint codes etc and only an expert would be able to tell.

As I said before it takes a brave man to tell the police his VIN number and then face the possibility of discovering the car is a stolen vehicle. I know of a Supra owner whose car is stolen but the police have allowed him to keep it while he traces the original owner/insurer.

If any of you are unlucky enough to find you have a stolen car I'll be happy to help with tracing the Jap insurers and negotiating a deal. Lets hope it doesn't come to this.