[Blow Dog]

OK - I'm going to outline the reason for the ban. This topic will be the FINAL DISCUSSION about this on the forum. Any other new threads will be locked without warning. Honestly, I'm getting real tired of this crap.

Firstly, message to Keith:

You continue to re-register and spam my user base with invitations to your new forum.

All I'll do is continue to ban you. I was due to speak to Michael G tomorrow on the phone to see if we could solve this problem but frankly, you're making this situation a lot harder. I also think it's important to tell people why you're banned, don't you?

1) You did not get the ego massage from us that you so wanted. You continually used your position as a prominent member of the community to gain financially from traders by advertising their wares on this forum and receiving freebies from them as a result. This has been mentioned to you a 100 times. We even let you sell your t-shirts and mugs. The final one was your prop shaft thread - an absolutely brilliant thread with valuable content which you duly crapped on by the blatant ad at the end of it. Amazing how you managed to get a free prop shaft and THEN put a huge ad up at the same time isn't it?

2) Your problem with Jason is not the concern of the forum. This goes for my moderators too because Christ knows I'm not showing favoritisms to anyone. Nobody deserves to be brought into the middle of what appears to have the potential of becoming a violent dispute. This forum is for discussions about Skylines and when Neanderthals start talking about breaking skulls, then crikey, you can all go take your ball and play elsewhere - I don't know about you but I'm a family man, fighting ended at 16 for me.

3) Your relationship with Rod Bell is healthy and I commend your loyalty, but continually attempting to ram the RB name down our throats in the absence of a paltry £25.00 banner is going to always push the wrong buttons. Imagine what could have been possible if there WAS a banner in place. However, I got a feeling you knew this and as a result, was happy to keep pushing those wrong buttons. You have a anarchistic nature.

Now you spam my users with invites to your new forum? You're only doing this because:
a) You've been banned from here.
b) You've been shunned on SOC.
c) You do not have the loyal fan base you thought you did.

This forum is not about an individual. This forum is about the car the namesake represents and if you are unable to act as an equal member of the community, then the community can do without you.

I've given Keith ample opportunity to contact me to discuss this problem - he has failed to do so on numerous occasions. My phone number is available to him, my email address is available to him. Michael has at least seen sense to try to pacify a situation which we both admit has gone way out of hand.

Again, I reiterate, my email address is here. If Keith wants to talk about this and put this mess behind us, then I will gladly have a chat on the phone.

Personally, I don't believe any of this is for public consumption. I don't like washing my laundry in public, so if people can PLEASE refrain from bringing this up again, I'll be most grateful.

I'm going to leave this thread open over the weekend at which point I'll lock it. Meanwhile, if anybody craps this thread up then I'll lock it earlier - let's try to have a reasoned discussion, ok?

Cem

p.s. I've also acknowledged that moderators posting in threads after they've been locked is wrong and ill-advised. In their defence, as a moderator you cannot clearly see that the thread is locked as you can still see the 'reply' feature, something hidden to normal users. I've mentioned this in another thread so hopefully we can put this to rest too.

 

[R33_GTS-t]

Well I think the results of this poll reflect people's opinions:

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/upload/6...een-banned-forum.html?highlight=keith+banning

Seen as this is intended as a discussion, I'm going to be frank. If JasonO wasn't a mod, Keith would not have been banned. I would suggest unbanning him and maintaining some self-respect.

As for the paltry £25 banner. 'Paltry' - so why are you so bothered?

 

[Durzel]

Well I think the results of this poll reflect people's opinions:

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/upload/6...een-banned-forum.html?highlight=keith+banning

Seen as this is intended as a discussion, I'm going to be frank. If JasonO wasn't a mod, Keith would not have been banned. I would suggest unbanning him and maintaining some self-respect.

As for the paltry £25 banner. 'Paltry' - so why are you so bothered?

Did your eyes just gloss over the first post in this thread or something? Keith has been the subject of mod discussion (re: banning) several times, and the ONLY reason it hasn't been done before is because it's a last resort. When someone (ANYONE, no one is exempt) flagrantly breaks practically all of the rules on here, ignores any requests for discussion with Cem, then what to YOU suggest should be done?

It sounds like you're advocating different rules for different people on here, which I'm sure you know is called "double standards". Ironically I'm sure you'd be the first person to **** and moan as soon as any suggestion of double standards crept in.

I'd suggest re-reading the first post in this thread until you understand it.

 

[R33_GTS-t]

Did your eyes just gloss over the first post in this thread or something? Keith has been the subject of mod discussion (re: banning) several times, and the ONLY reason it hasn't been done before is because it's a last resort. When someone (ANYONE, no one is exempt) flagrantly breaks practically all of the rules on here, ignores any requests for discussion with Cem, then what to YOU suggest should be done?

It sounds like you're advocating different rules for different people on here, which I'm sure you know is called "double standards". Ironically I'm sure you'd be the first person to **** and moan as soon as any suggestion of double standards crept in.

I'd suggest re-reading the first post in this thread until you understand it.

From what I read, in the thread in question. A remark was made clearly relating to an incident at TOTB which Keith responded to:

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/upload/61706-arm-chair-warriors-2.html?highlight=arm+chair

It sounds like you're advocating different rules for different people on here

No, just less rules altogether. It's a 'Rant' forum. Keith and JasonO were ranting and hence complying fully with the forum description.

 

[stealth]

Well I think the results of this poll reflect people's opinions:

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/upload/6...een-banned-forum.html?highlight=keith+banning

Seen as this is intended as a discussion, I'm going to be frank. If JasonO wasn't a mod, Keith would not have been banned. I would suggest unbanning him and maintaining some self-respect.

As for the paltry £25 banner. 'Paltry' - so why are you so bothered?

You clearly cant read can you?

Self respect! lol, Thats almost funny seeing as it's coming from you .

Cem's pointed out the rules for advertising for Christ's sake .

Why do you continue to stire the pot on nearly every thread?

 

[Blow Dog]

Well I think the results of this poll reflect people's opinions:

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/upload/6...een-banned-forum.html?highlight=keith+banning

Seen as this is intended as a discussion, I'm going to be frank. If JasonO wasn't a mod, Keith would not have been banned. I would suggest unbanning him and maintaining some self-respect.

As for the paltry £25 banner. 'Paltry' - so why are you so bothered?

R33_GTS-t,

Considering that you are the argumentative person on the whole forum, I class any response from you as nothing other than provocative.
How many times have you been banned? (Let's not count the 30 alias's you registered, shall we?)

I cannot make reasoned debate with you, but I'll humour your questions anyway.

My banning Keith has nothing to do with Jason - take off your blinkers and read exactly what I'm saying because god knows I'm sick to death of repeating myself. Keith was banned because he failed to respond to a question I posed to him about physically threatning someone on this forum. End of.

If one thing's intact, it's my dignity. I have not yet lowered myself to the depths you suggest to gain back any self-respect.

Trade rules are black & white. If you do not understand the simple concept of advertising, ask and I shall explain. Otherwise I can only assume you're looking for me to state the obvious.

 

[R33_GTS-t]

You clearly cant read can you?

Self respect! lol, Thats almost funny seeing as it's coming from you .

Cem's pointed out the rules for advertising for Christ's sake .

Why do you continue to stire the pot on nearly every thread?

I can't read? Should Keith be banned? 29 NO votes to 2 YES votes.

This thread was created to discuss the matter. I'm doing that.

 

[Demon Dave]

R33_GTS-t I think it is you

who can't read.

 

[R33_GTS-t]

My banning Keith has nothing to do with Jason - take off your blinkers and read exactly what I'm saying because god knows I'm sick to death of repeating myself. Keith was banned because he failed to respond to a question I posed to him about physically threatning someone on this forum. End of.

Did Keith see your question? Did he know you wanted a response? Maybe he just left the thread to allow things to cool down by themselves. Your pre-ban warnings are cryptic at best if they exist at all. As for the spamming, you got off lightly, your servers are still up. I've heard of a lot worse.

Trade rules are black & white. If you do not understand the simple concept of advertising, ask and I shall explain. Otherwise I can only assume you're looking for me to state the obvious.

Let me explain the concept of advertising to you. We did have the owner of the fastest UK GTR on this board. Now we don't. You just fired the Giselle of the UK skyline scene. So Keith's eccentric. He drives a 1200+hp GTR, what did you expect?

 

[R33_GTS-t]

who can't read.

Well, when someone tells you that you can't read, they better get their literacy up to scratch whilst doing so.

And may I say, what a big surprise it was to see you join in the attack.

 

[Durzel]

I can't read? You can't spell or use apostrophes.:chuckle: Should Keith be banned? 29 NO votes to 2 YES votes.

This thread was created to discuss the matter. I'm doing that.

Picking up someone on typos is a pretty weak reply to an argument. Are you not able to answer his points?

Incidentally, the principal rules of the forum are not open to discussion/voting, especially when not everyone is in full possession of the facts. To depersonalise it you might as well put up a poll asking whether people should be banned for continually flouting trade advertising rules, or whether people should be banned for personal physical threats & abuse, as those are the issues behind this specific ban.

Let me explain the concept of advertising to you.

:chuckle:

We did have the owner of the fastest UK GTR on this board. Now we don't.

No one is above the rules. Did you forget the part where I mentioned about "double standards"? Hello? McFly?

 

[paul creed]

I can't read? You can't spell or use apostrophes.:chuckle: Should Keith be banned? 29 NO votes to 2 YES votes.

This thread was created to discuss the matter. I'm doing that.

Actually, i think that answer in itself puts things in a clear picture.
29 votes say NO.....mmm, how people on this forum? How many people know of Keith and his car? and only 29 people bother to answer!!
Personally, and i'm sure its the same with the majority, i don't particularly care whether Keith is here on this forum or not, as i do not know him personally, nor have i ever met him. I have great respect for his car, and his achievements as i know alot of the ideas and work were his own, but i dont feel the need to bow down to Keith, and i suspect he doesnt expect me to either. Keith is no different to me, no better and no more immune to a good bollocking.
It all depends on what you want out of a community and what you expect of people, if you have no respect for either, then feeling is generally mutual.

 

[raz0r$harP]

I applaud the job that you and the rest of the mods/admins are doing Cem. I don't think ppl realise the effort that goes on behind the scenes in keeping a large forum going..

 

[R33_GTS-t]

Picking up someone on typos is a pretty weak reply to an argument. Are you not able to answer his points?

I did that too. Call it multi-tasking. Anyway, I've deleted the spelling corrections to save offence, because it is clearly only allowed in one direction.

Incidentally, the principal rules of the forum are not open to discussion/voting, especially when not everyone is in full possession of the facts.

It's never stopped people voting before.:chuckle: Are you saying this is a fascist board?

To depersonalise it you might as well put up a poll asking whether people should be banned for continually flouting trade advertising rules, or whether people should be banned for personal physical threats & abuse, as those are the issues behind this specific ban.

Depends on the circumstances.

No one is above the rules. Did you forget the part where I mentioned about "double standards"? Hello? McFly?

So would you ban yourself if you were offensive to someone on this board? Would you ban another mod?

 

[Mookistar]

nowhere on that thread does it discuss the REAL reasons

If you were to hold a poll, asking if traders who blatentley flout the clear cut rules this forum has, should be banned, against the potential cost of losing the forum as other advertisers withdraw thier funds which help pay for the running of this place.

I personally think it's foolish to seocnd guess Cem's decision, bearing in mind, we are all freeloaders here.

mook

 

[R33_GTS-t]

Actually, i think that answer in itself puts things in a clear picture.
29 votes say NO.....mmm, how people on this forum? How many people know of Keith and his car? and only 29 people bother to answer!!

The thread was closed early. Given the rate the votes stacked up at, it speaks for itself. Only 2 people voted YES, so how many people share your view? 1 in 15 is the answer.

Personally, and i'm sure its the same with the majority, i don't particularly care whether Keith is here on this forum or not, as i do not know him personally, nor have i ever met him. I have great respect for his car, and his achievements as i know alot of the ideas and work were his own, but i dont feel the need to bow down to Keith, and i suspect he doesnt expect me to either. Keith is no different to me, no better and no more immune to a good bollocking.
It all depends on what you want out of a community and what you expect of people, if you have no respect for either, then feeling is generally mutual.

I agree, but I don't feel that was the matter here.

 

[R33_GTS-t]

nowhere on that thread does it discuss the REAL reasons

If you were to hold a poll, asking if traders who blatentley flout the clear cut rules this forum has, should be banned, against the potential cost of losing the forum as other advertisers withdraw thier funds which help pay for the running of this place.

I personally think it's foolish to seocnd guess Cem's decision, bearing in mind, we are all freeloaders here.

mook

Not entirely. We pay for internet subscription and browse here. If we didn't, the people paying for the adverts above and around wouldn't do so, as nobody would see them.

 

[liquidculture]

All seems pretty straightforward to me, at least as far as the advertising goes, as for the rest - all seems pretty stupid to me but I havent been following it (boring), if you want to advertise then pay for it the same as everone else, it all goes towards our benefit in the end.

 

[Durzel]

I did that too. Call it multi-tasking. Anyway, I've deleted the spelling corrections to save offence, because it is clearly only allowed in one direction.

It's allowed in every direction, to a point. I should hope you can understand that very real threats of physical violence are a World apart from keyboard warrior crap, and name-calling. Hell, both you and Mycroft have at it in practically every thread on here. Keith (and others) have made very specific threats of violence against another member of the forum (who happens to be a mod). Trust me, if the same happened with anyone else and it was thought to be serious (especially if said threats were followed up with threats in person) it would end up with the same result.

If anything if I were in Jasons shoes I would be quite exasperated that Keith hadn't been banned the day after it all happened, I know I would be. Despite what you might think, assume, or claim to know - Cem has exhausted every available option to him before sanctioning this ban.

It's never stopped people voting before.:chuckle: Are you saying this is a fascist board?

Nope, I'm saying that certain rules are not open to discussion. It's not like you're being asked to pay a mandatory licence fee to use this forum. There is a simple solution to avoid having to conform to ANY of the rules on here, and I'm sure I don't have to spell it out. Forcible compliance with rules you don't agree with would only be a fascist dictatorship if you had no choice in the matter....

Depends on the circumstances.

The circumstances are in the first post on this thread, which you seem to continue to ignore to suit your "argument".

So would you ban yourself if you were offensive to someone on this board? Would you ban another mod?

Wouldn't have to. For a start Cem would ask that person to step down, and secondly none of us are stupid enough that violence or the threat of it is our only recourse in an argument. :chuckle: Incidentally I'm not talking about "calling people names" because people do that everywhere on here, including you, although it is a bit of a lazy way out of an argument.

Your problem is you think this is personal when it isn't. If anything, if someone who had just registered on the site had done even one of the things Cem has mentioned then chances are they would be banned first and questions asked later. Keith was afforded every possible avenue of discussion to avoid this, and chose to ignore it - perhaps thinking, like you seem to, that he is above the rules because of the size of his <span style="text-decoration: line-through;">collection box</span> pockets.

 

[JB.]

R33 GTST has anybody told you that your really, really BORING.
I personally I am getting sick of seeing your name.
Sorry for going off topic.