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Mike

Keep the faith, revs the nuts off it, hit the limiter 24/7, its got 2 choices and at 50K so far your due a blow up soon if you run that kinda boost most times anyway, go out with a bang!:D

Peter, if you phone Gary @ GT Art you will find that he has some very nice catch tanks, been made from scratch and you know what the mans like, very particular about fine things.... I am picking one up from him, they should have been made this week, worth waiting for, you know the number dont you?

The 7200rpm limit business is what the standard skylines peak power is at from the factory so running over that is just a load of noise on a standard car but you aint running standard are you Peter so just work out from your dyno sheets what revs you do need to acheive before bangin in the next cog, lets face it, if you crank has lasted this long, what the fick. Its done trackdays and hard drives over that uptil now aint it?

The moral to this debate is that as I pointed out to Gren San a couple of times already during various discussions - we are all on borrowed time before our cars blow up, if you own one and dont expect it to blow bigstyle at some point then you are just kidding yourself cos its gonna happen and its got nothing to do with who built it etc etc, its just a sobering fact of owning a money pit.:)

I hit mine right round to 8500rpm when dragging but only rev to 8100ish on the road when thrashing the shit out of it, on a standard bottom end - but it will blow up, its just when, but thats the russian roulet game we all play, it only takes a second to go!
 

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dunno how relevent this is... :) but my stock RB25 auto non turbo will (has) change(d) gear at 7117rpm in power mode without overdrive... :D
this is the max rpm shown on my RSM which seems pretty accurate...
used to hit the rev limiter on my old cars all the time, usually overtaking in second gear... :) never hurt the engine... but have broken a gearstick!! :)
 

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Revs

No point revving past maximum power, which depends on the cams.

If a stock Nissan engine redlines at 8200rpm, then Nissan are damn sure it will last 100,000 miles or they wouldn't let it out the factory with that limit (warranty claims are expensive etc).

I have never seen or heard of a stock crank breaking or bending, anyone seen one?

My car has the rev limit set at 8800rpm, which is the maximum an FC Commander allows. My car makes peak power at 8800rpm and is still climbing (the cam setup may not be to everyone's taste). I have a stock crank, but uprated rods and pistons.

Mario in Australia used a stock bottom-end for 700+bhp and 9500rpm. His new car is designed to rev 11,500rpm!

The 2.8 HKS Kit is designed to rev to 10,000rpm and I have video of the Top Secret Car doing it.

Guy
 

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HKS Kits

Keith,

I know they do two different type of 2.8 kits, the method of design of the kits is different as well in terms of pin sizes I recall, though as you say the main difference is in the quality of the crank.

Some owners have the more expensive 2.8 kit and some the cheaper 2.8l kit, though I will not comment on whom has what, since they are not my cars.

I suspect it was oil surge rather than revs that killed that particular crank though, as it was on the 'ring and being driven how we know that car got driven, ie very hard

Guy
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Andy,

I'm sure I've got his number somewhere... :)

'revs the nuts off it'.... Funny how you've got a complete lack of understanding that us mere mortals with mortgages, overdrafts, children, credit card bills, etc. etc. worry about large rebuild bills! Oh, to be poluted, must be nice.... ;)

Guy,

If you want to exceed 8.8k with the PFC, you have the opportunity to do so using the FC Pro. It allows you to adjust the overall map parameters, e.g. rev spacings, load spacings, etc.

There is a case to argue as far as exceeding the revs at which maximum power is achieved (clearly not in your case though as you don't yet know where that is) in so much as you will reach the next gear at higher revs/boost which will achieve an overall benefit in acceleration. It will also compensate slightly for the time taken to actually change gear unless you've got a sequential box.

Now to own up, I changed the oil and filter (again!) last week so I thought I'd check the level this evening and embarrassingly, it was over by nearly 1/4" which I guess may explain some of the oil away. :eek: I'm still going to order the catchtank tomorrow, I see DT have a nice red Mocal one listed which I reckon will squeeze in somewhere leaving the washer bottle where it is.

Peter.
 

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Interesting!

I have been following this thread with interest and see a big comparison in a number of areas!!
Keith has reported max power at 7160 rpm with his cams fitted, and mike has stated mex power at 8000+ rpm and my question is ! why has the peak power moved?? is ibecos of the cams??
When my motor why dyno'd back in April the operator backed off at 7,150 when the line was going vertical and asking rod why this happened he said the car was STILL ON CAM!
Until i get another dyno run done now the car has been changed so much, i cannot say where the peak power is!!!
However one point i would like to make is that i did play around with the boost and rev limit settings at Elvington a couple of weeks ago, and did NOT run any faster by upping the rev limit!

Stu
 

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Discussion Starter #28
Stu,

I may be totally wrong here but transmission losses have a part to play when peak power is being measured on some dynos. Not wishing to resurrect the question of flywheel and at the wheel power, some dyno operators will continue doing a power run even when power at the wheels starts falling as the calculated transmission losses exceed this drop off, hence an overall increase in engine power is still being reported. I think you will find that most if not all the cars which show peak power at these higher revs, if you look at the dyno sheets, power at the wheels will have started dropping off by then.

Peter.
 

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Power

Peter,

Very good point.

Whilst my engine power peaked at 8800rpm, I think the peak wheel power was nearer 8000rpm.

The point about where it drops into the powerband after gearchange is also the key as what revs to change gear at if you going beyond peak power. Its still worth revving provided the added bhp through the increase in the point you drop into the next gear more than offsets the power drop-off in the gear you are in (does that make sense?).

Guy
 

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Agreed!

Peter/Guy,

Very good points made there, i think it will be worth while putting the car on another dyno for comparison...
I also did not realise that max revs on the Apexi was 8,800rpm?
I can also equate to the gear change rev synario as still having my five speed box, the car does take time to spool up again in between gear changes, something i suppose could be improved , but then that is down to the gearbox and £££'s i suppose!

Thanks

Stu
 

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PeterE said:
Andy,

I'm sure I've got his number somewhere... :)

'revs the nuts off it'.... Funny how you've got a complete lack of understanding that us mere mortals with mortgages, overdrafts, children, credit card bills, etc. etc. worry about large rebuild bills! Oh, to be poluted, must be nice.... ;)

WHAT?

NO UNCLE PETER, NOT CAVALIER IN MY ATTITUDE TO ENGINE DEATH, JUST REALISTIC, ITS GONNA HAPPEN SO WHY NOT MAKE THE MOST OF IT, GIVE ME YOUR CAR FOR A WEEK AND I WILL SEE WHAT I CAN DO FOR YOU;) I AM QUITE GOOD AT KILLING R33'S, GONNA BE ON MY THIRD REBUILD WITH MY SILVER GTR, GETTING USED TO THE GUT WRENCHING 'OH SHIT' FEELING YOU GET WHEN IT HAPPENS....:D
 

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if you can only rev to say 7.5k then...

why did mr nisaan start the redline at 8k?? Surely this would leave Nissan somewhat liable as you can easily reads the last know point of max revs from the ECU.
If the crank or engine went at say 7.7k then you could argue why set the limit higher when you know full well it will not withstand.
I don't think you will ever be able to get the right answer or agree and I guess it deoends oin tuner, longevity and general engine condition.
You could be lucky or not.
Me, well my car made max power at 7.2k so why go on any higher?? Will only use that bit more for track days and maybe the odd 0-60.
just my 2p.

NLW

Pete, you seen gazmo lately or is he still buried in those double Js??
 

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Dirk Diggler said:

NO UNCLE PETER, NOT CAVALIER IN MY ATTITUDE TO ENGINE DEATH, JUST REALISTIC, ITS GONNA HAPPEN SO WHY NOT MAKE THE MOST OF IT
Sorry Andy,
I disagree. If you are constantly raping your car to 8.5k revs then youre asking for trouble and yes, you should expect it to go bang. But if like me, youre changing gear at just over peak power and in a good enough range to maximise the next gear (7500) then youre well below the redline and far from stressing your engine. I aim to preserve 10k's worth of engine and contrary to popular belief, Id be suprised to hear from anymore than 4 people on this board who wouldn't care if their engine went pop.

I may be wrong, but didn't Nissan put the red-line and the limiter in there for a reason?

Cem, not really technical.

:)
 

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My car has got 422 [email protected] I was told, if I keep the boost at 1.1 bar and take care of it (not 8500rpm gear changes ;) ) it should run for a year with no problems. That includes the pod, banzai, dyno days. If my car blows, you won't see it again for a year:(
Dirk, you just an sado-machinistic ass-whippin' bitch:eek: ;) :D
Your cars only blow up because they hate you for thrashin' em:p
Dave
p.s. I have not been to the pub
 

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Sado

Thanks Dave, how well you know me.

Its a catch 22 really, They blow up cos I cane them sooo hard, I cane them sooo hard cos they blow up, just getting my revenge, you can see me on the drag days, in the driving seat, talking to them, goes something like this ' right you ficking bastad, youre gonna get it and youre gonna have to like it you bastad, come oooooooonnnnnnnnnn' whooooosh - smash thru into second - smash thru into third, smash thru into fourth.

I can feel it crying when its all over, its like Ive put the whip away after giving it 50 lashes.

I Love it. 8500rpm all the way, no surrender, take no prisoners.

Cem - stop getting technical;) So then, what you are saying is that you drive about under 8000rpm and this is going to make your engine last forever is it? If you have 10K of mods on your car then those same mods are making your engine even more stressed than it was when it was standard so 8000rpm on 10K of bits is in the same league as standard at 9000rpm in my books. regardless of revs, what about high boost, do you not think running higher boost will have an effect on the life of your engine?

I say as I said originally - we are all on borrowed time, its just the lottery of when it will happen, standard or otherwise.

As for not caring, well to be honest, you get past that stage when everytime you look at the car it costs thousands and after a while you just think ' what the fick, if i didnt like spending the money out all the time I should buy an escort 'and the strange thing is once you have had a skyline, you cant walk away, youre in for good and spending money on parts and rebuilds is no different to putting petrol in the tank unfortunately.:)

My silver car is on its third rebuild of me owning it, its outside, covered in bird shite, bottom end blown, owes my about 35-40K so far in everything over the past 3 odd years and its still blown up, anyone in the right mind would say ' i give in, I cant keep up', its like having a nymphomanic shoppahollic as your wife, its a full time liability and very hard to please:p

Wow, I keep coming out with sensible conversation ( well sensible for me ), whats happening, you see what you's are doing to me!!!!:D :smokin:
 

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Strange way of putting it?

So when I discovered my engine had problems caused by the previous owner and I decided to pay a great sum of money for a new engine and turbos etc.. was it all a complete waste of money??

Am I soon to have to go down the same route again?

I have been instructed that regular oil and coolant changes and basically looking after the car should see the engine long thru the 40K miles zone without any problems. (which is 15K more than the stock RB26 made!).

I am sure that if we were all consciously aware that our treasured Skylines was going to blow up at somepoint and that it was out of our hands that 1. we would not spend heaps on them and 2. May be consider buying something much more reliable instead!

All very strange this!

..IS
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Automotive hooligan.

Wouldn't it be a boring place if we were all the same, heh?

Andy, if you can afford, which you obviously can, go for it. Just stay well clear of my car, that's all, stay well clear...! ;)

Unc.
 

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max revs

but guys in japan the GTRs were limited to 0.8 bar of boost and
a top speed of something like 110 mph
so the engines were not put under the same load as ours in the uk
they did not get the oil coolers fitted to the engine,diffs and gearbox
like they fit to the UK models that are not limited.

KEV
 
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