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NISFAN said:
SteveN,
I am truely baffled by your build, you say you only want 700hp, but have fitted a 900+ Turbo????? Perhaps you've changed your goals, but to answer your question, why would you spend OSG money on an RB30E just so it could safely rev higher? Surely buying a OSG crate engine is far easier? Upto you, as I said, nice to have the choice, and hope you get what you wanted.

Steve are you blacknblack? or is it Todd? Don't you hate it when someone snipes anonymously? Come on mods tell us who this mysterious person is. lol.
Baffled? How? I want 700+, im not some nobhead like most whos making all these big claims wiothout proof, and anything over 700 and im happy, but in reality theres very little, well, nothing really, to stop it being 900. Its not a 900+turbo really, its rated at 900, so that power is totally rinsing the **** out the turbo at mega boost.

And have you never seen 99% of the cars on here? How many rinse every last bit of power from their turbos? Almost none, as youd need to be running 2bar+ and they dont, so I dont get your point.

And my point of the last post I put makes the next question pointless so dunno why you asked it. I wouldnt spend OSG money on a Nissan RB30 unless I knew itd be better.
But I dont know either way, and dont care, as im not building an incredible drag car like Keith is.
But what I DO know, is its better financial sense to use it for what I am doing.

I wanna know balcknblack AND ollam69 is, thye both clearly people involved on both sides who are too cowardly (how can you be scared on a sadass car forum FFS!) to post as who they really are.

Seems to me your now just digging at pointless things to try and argue, but dont bother, as you may have noticed I actually understad my reasoning and not making pointless blinkered comments like half the rest of the forum ;)
 

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On the subject of engine blocks, if BMW can get upto 1500bhp out of a 2l 4cylinder block that came into production in 1977(I think) in a boring old saloon car as used in the 1983 F1 car, I really can't see the issue about believing whether an RB30 block is any good for high hp builds.

This really does show that you can't judge a block by its car. There are many over examples, although not so extreme of how an engine block is never the limiting factor of an engines hp.

If these engines really are a crock of shite, as some seem to be suggesting AND they are made and tuned in 'back street garages', why do the likes of Abbey Motorsport supply and fit RB30's. Mark has a high power RB30 for his car. He's a knowlegeable chap, so if they really are that prehistoric, poorly engineered and unreliable surly he wouldn't have bothered.

It's really comes down to what you actually know. And it seems a lot of people on here don't know that much at all. They would rather have a pop at people who try something a little unorthodox.

I guess its only natural for people who have invested soo much time and money to brush off the idea that there are better options out there.

Anyway, you pays your money and you takes your chance.
 

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cokey said:
But if nissan could have just slapped an rb 26 head on their already mass produced 3 litre single cam engine.........
Why invent the race bred RB 26 ??????
Why did they go for 2.6 and not 2.7, 2.8, 3litre, etc then?
Your point is invalid unless you just saying not to use ANY 3litre ;)

How many BLOCKS (of any kind) have people seen fail that wasnt a thrown rod or similar misuse? Very few.
So I dont understand the big fuss.
How many cranks have people seen fail that wasnt an oil/det issue? Very few.
But peope still upgrade for 100cc more theyd not even feel for "reliability" reasons.

R32 Combat said:
It's really comes down to what you actually know. And it seems a lot of people on here don't know that much at all. They would rather have a pop at people who try something a little unorthodox.
Exactly why I generally keep away from here and post nowt about my car here.
Its the same on SXOC and why I never bother with that place even though I have a 200SX too!
 

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SteveN said:
Baffled? How? I want 700+, im not some nobhead like most whos making all these big claims wiothout proof, and anything over 700 and im happy, but in reality theres very little, well, nothing really, to stop it being 900. Its not a 900+turbo really, its rated at 900, so that power is totally rinsing the **** out the turbo at mega boost.

And have you never seen 99% of the cars on here? How many rinse every last bit of power from their turbos? Almost none, as youd need to be running 2bar+ and they dont, so I dont get your point.
Just that in the past, you've commented on the majority of people on here running high compression (8.5:1) and the fact that you can't run high boost because of.
You've often quoted cossie figures running low CR and high boost (2+bar), and stated thats the way to go.
You've also commented on people using bigger than needed turbo's.
 

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I know, and thats why im running lower comp than usual and using a turbo that will max out about where the engine would be maxing out too.

I just dont want to make big claims without being able to prove it, ive not got an engine spec thats been done before, so I can only go from calculations and educated guesses, same as anyone else who hasnt got an engin spec exactly the same as other folk.

I know its the way to go for what I want as ive done it enough times before, dont give a toss what others do, up to them.

Bigger than needed if they could safely run more boost, but they cant due to their engine specs, so they do need them turbos and just have to suffer pooh power delivery for the power they want.

Dunno why you keep posting, you clearly did understand what I was saying from the start, just nitpicking.
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
Steve the only point I was making was that nissan having set their goals for the skyline way under this magic 1000 hp.
Chose not to utilise an engine they already had in production.
And went to the expense of a new production run.
thats all.
I was not having a pop at anyone. I have the greatest respect for Hugh and his car. Mainly because of the Informative and interesting input he gives to this forum.
Cossycam the smilie at the end of the sentence you quoted means sarcastic.
Glad to see you from your pic that your still line dancing though. :D

As to why some people have chosen to comment under a pseudonym ?
Who knows ?
Cokey
 

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"But if nissan could have just slapped an rb 26 head on their already mass produced 3 litre single cam engine.........
Why invent the race bred RB 26 ??????"

Because the BNR32 was designed to win Japanese Group A touring car races and as there were weight penalties versus engine displacement the race engineers dictated that the 2.6 option could give the best power to weight ratio on the track. I have a great little book here that is filled with charts and tables showing how they considered every possible Nissan powerplant right up to a VH45 NA V8 4.5 litre.
 

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To understand the Australian RB30, you need to look at the whole history of the engine. It was the result of a tie up between Nissan Japan, and General Motors Holden in Australia. GMH needed a modern OHC EFI engine to replace the obsolete ancient pushrod carby engine they had been using.

But it had to compete directly with Fords 4.1 litre six cylinder engine. Australians (just like Americans) like big torquey engines. It was felt that the RB25DE just did not feel right to the average Aussie driver. While Japanese and European drivers are not afraid to use a few Rpm, out here a 2.5 litre engine just would not have the balls to compete in the market place with a 4.1 litre engine. That original Ford pushrod engine had a redline of only 4,100 Rpm and developed peak torque at only 1200 Rpm. But with an automatic transmission, it would easily pull around a heavy family car without noise or drama.

So the unique Aussie RB30E was born. Long stroke, big capacity, not particularly powerful, but it was exactly what the market here demanded to power taxis, very basic low end family sedans, and commercial vehicles. Nobody cared less about what it did over 5,000 Rpm becaue the breathing was so poor it could never get up there anyway. It was never designed to be a sports car engine.

The biggest weakness of that engine was the long flexy stroker crank, which is known to cause severe torsional vibration problems around about 6500 to 6800 Rpm. Those sorts of Rpm are just about impossible to reach with a standard RB30E anyway, so it was never a limitation.

Even the turbo version, the RB30ET was never a high reving engine. It made buckets of torque, and performed very well without needing to rev.

There are still thousands, maybe tens of thousands of older cars getting around with the original RB30E and RB30ET engines here in Australia. People are bolting on DOHC heads onto these old cars and getting fantastic performance. Realise though, that these old cars sell secondhand for about a thousand english pounds, and you get the general idea.

Young blokes in their teens with dreams and no money, are building up these RB30DET engines and fitting them to rust bucket cars and street racing them.

There is absolutely no comparison between a prime RB26DETT professionally built race engine, or a properly engineered Japanese stroker kit to what is going on out here in Australia right now.

There is absolutely nothing at all wrong with a budget RB30DET engine of maybe 400 to 500 Hp. That is quite enough power for most people, and it is very easy to do. Much more sensible than an expensively modified V8 which is about the only real alternative.

But 100Hp+ is just not realistic, the bare original block is about the only thing that you could possibly use. But I suppose that would still mean it is an RB30, right?
 

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Whats the max power you can get from an RB26 WITHOUT changing any internal parts?? 600hp?? No-one really knows. Some would suggest you should have change to forged pistons by then, some say you need pistons and rod. There is no definate point whan parts need changing.

I don't know about the RB30, but mines only got forged pistons and it was built for that power.

As soon as you buy a stroker kit for an RB26, all you are using is the block so its not really an RB26 anymore.

The OGS doesn't use ANY original RB26 parts because you can't rely on nissan parts for that power.

The JUN/HKS/Apexi stroker kits only use the block.

So IF you replace the crank/rods and piston in an RB30 but don't stroke it, you can get the same power.

To me, thats all you have to understand when compairing all the different 'RB' engine configurations.
 

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As i always said........ What it comes down to is this.....

What ever that has been done to the rb26/30 OSGiken kit,,,, Can be done to the Real RB30, for big horse power applications,, including a billet crank so it will rev...... for the big spenders JUST DOESNT HAVE OSGIKEN on it:bawling:

But also you can get one, slap a set of forged pistons in it, balance it, n1 oil pump and safely make 500hp to the feet and nearly the same torque,,,,,,as i did to mine,, and i used bits and peices i had laying around my workshop, rb25 head, rb20 manifold, cast pistons slapped in not even bored, cheap rings, cheap bearings, standard rb30 na oil pump and a grafite head gasket and made 500 to the rears and 469ft/lb at 1.7 bar.......... so good for the budget builder!!!!!!!!!

A osgiken rb30 isnt in everyones budget,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, but a real rb30 is a bit more in peoples reach,,, if it be a drop in, low budget torque maker for the person who wants better off boost driving and to get that turbo on boost quicker,,,, or for the full blown drag car builder,, that the extra money that isnt being spent on the osgiken badge and the alloy spacer,,,, can be spent on a ecu and turbo to run it!!!!!!!!
 

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Sorry for asking a dumb question Steve I was just curious what the defaults are.

I think I agree with some of the other people really, if you spent 10k on an RB30 it would be pritty similar to an OSG.
 

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cokey said:
Cossycam the smilie at the end of the sentence you quoted means sarcastic.
Glad to see you from your pic that your still line dancing though. :D
Cokey
Mea Culpa. Apologies Cokey I misunderstood your post.:thumbsup:

Line dancing WTF??:confused:
 

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Hi Guys,

Just letting you know that I have built a few RB26/RB30 engines using the Nissan RB30 bottom end and have never had one fail due to an inherent weakness in the engine itself, being a longer stroke engine there are a few things that have to be done to ensure it lives at extreme power levels ie dont turn it no 9000rpm with the standard crank.

The following is an example of the power we have made with some different combos

RB26/RB30 Forged Pistons standard rods, crank, cams only other upgrades where T66 turbo and fuel system 400rwkw, rev limit 7000rpm

RB26/30 same as above with cams 450rwkw rev limit 7500rpm

RB26/30 same as the first engine with Forged Rods, larger cams, HKS T51R
SPL 520rwkw

RB26/30 with the full monty:
Billet Crank (custom unit)
Forged Rods (custom length)
Forged Pistons (custom pistons)
Larger 280/11.5mm cams
Oil system modifications
Twin 3240 Turbo Setup
9000rpm rev limit
640rwkw on race fuel

The OS RB30 is a good thing but I am of the opinion that for half the money they charge we can build a bottom end just as good that will have alot of features the OS engine will not have such as billet crank girdle, oil system upgrades to name two.

We have since moved onto the VH V8 Nissan engine as the RB engines are a dime a dozen over here. Oh and just to clear something up if you wish to make over 900hp out of an Rb26 about the only standard thing that you could use would be the head casting and the block the rest will be thow away items having said that the standard crank may hold up but I nver like turning a crank which is not fully counter weighted to 10,000rpm

Cheers
 

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Good reply.

It's nice to hear some 1st hand experiance..

Looks like I should hit the 600hp mark with ease and hopefully some reliability.
 

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I have never had a failier of any kind either and thats after literally hundreds of 4th gear burnouts and 10 second 1/4's, all on a totally stock unmodified RB30e bottom end with a totally stock unmodified R32 RB25de head (the worst of the lot) with a stock RB20det exhaust manifold, stock gearbox, stock diffs and axles etc.

For "MOST" people a genuine 500whp is plenty, we go to well over 600whp with totally stock (ie, stock, used, unmodified crank, pistons and rods, no aftermarket cams, porting, stock head gasket etc) motors, that is good value for money in anyones book.

Plenty of guys all over the world have spent huge money on 26's and still not done a 10 or surely not a low 10.

Unless you have more money than sence, OR want a "genuine" 1000+hp the OS is not even worth considering.

If you do have alot of money and are going to build a "genuine" 1000+hp engine, at this stage I would recommend the OS.
(we have yet to test the limits of the stock parts, but intend to do so very soon)

Bang for buck the aussie/nz RB30 can't be beaten and they run 8's in NZ and Aussie with stock blocks and cranks (just to clear that up for some of you)
I even know of one NZ car that has done a high 8 with stock RB30e pistons and rods!!

My 2c. Robbie.
 

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R.I.P.S NZ said:
I have never had a failier of any kind either and thats after literally hundreds of 4th gear burnouts and 10 second 1/4's, all on a totally stock unmodified RB30e bottom end with a totally stock unmodified R32 RB25de head (the worst of the lot) with a stock RB20det exhaust manifold, stock gearbox, stock diffs and axles etc.

For "MOST" people a genuine 500whp is plenty, we go to well over 600whp with totally stock (ie, stock, used, unmodified crank, pistons and rods, no aftermarket cams, porting, stock head gasket etc) motors, that is good value for money in anyones book.

Plenty of guys all over the world have spent huge money on 26's and still not done a 10 or surely not a low 10.

Unless you have more money than sence, OR want a "genuine" 1000+hp the OS is not even worth considering.

If you do have alot of money and are going to build a "genuine" 1000+hp engine, at this stage I would recommend the OS.
(we have yet to test the limits of the stock parts, but intend to do so very soon)

Bang for buck the aussie/nz RB30 can't be beaten and they run 8's in NZ and Aussie with stock blocks and cranks (just to clear that up for some of you)
I even know of one NZ car that has done a high 8 with stock RB30e pistons and rods!!

My 2c. Robbie.
I did a 10.6 on a stock rb26 with a t78 turbo in my gold 32 100% stock car had 68000 miles on it.


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