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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
09 Black Edition
Stage 4 or there abouts?
GTC mapping
GTC intakes
GTC Asnu injectors
Decat downpipes
Miltek y-pipe
Forge blow off valves
OEM tyres
Gearbox clips done
Serviced frequently


I want more power... Certainly without huge expense (x£10,000's)

I'm never going to build the engine, and they are good for nearly 750bhp on standard internals? So looking at buying turbos and whatever else to get near that.

Does anyone know what bhp I'll get with my current setup getting better blowers on?
How restrictive is my standard back half of the exhaust? I'm happy with the noise now so only looking to change for power increase.

Was here at the weekend:


Against an 800bhp R32 GTR




Is this time about right for my car? I'd like a little better :) OEM tyres holding me back much? as can't deflate due to the runflat?


And was out playing with these yesterday:




Was AS quick, but being QUICKER wouldn't be a bad thing would it ;)
I'm ready for the next stage of power, just looking for some advice on how best to achieve this.

Thanks.
 

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The egines might well be good for 750bhp but they are capped by the Torque they can take on standard internals (around 630ft/lbs) so theoretically speaking by adding more bhp you're not going to go "quicker", you will just end up going faster.

You will need to do stage 1 engine works at the very least (around 4K I think) to be able to bump the torque upwards.

After you have done the internals you are looking at turbos, fuel pumps, FMIC etc so you are looking at another 7-10K

Once you've done that then you will start stretching the legs on the gearbox, depending on how far you go, so this will need addressing.

Acceleration aint cheap sadly and it's never just one thing to change :(
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yeah already got torque capped so I know i'm just looking @ 100bhp increase, I'm happy with this :)

Just looking at turbos that are 'tuned up' oem ones capable of 700-750bhp, and pumps yes, forgot that.

Gearbox clips already done, hoping that'll be enough for 700bhp.

But that's why I'm here, to ask people with experience :)
 

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Your time can be around 10.6 - 10.8 with a decent launch, terminal times of 129 - 134mph

I've similar set-up and thats what I get, if I see a 2.2 - 2.4sec 60ft time it's usually 11.2 -11.4 sec times I would say if you look at your slip that's the sort of 60ft time you'll have got. Cut that down to 1.9 sec 60ft and you'll see the time drop 0.3 - 0.4sec to 60ft which will see a drop at the far end with a higher terminal from a better launch that'll see you hit those 10.6 - 10.8.
 

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Just wondering if you just did internals instead of turbos then upped the torque would this work better than doing turbos? Anybody's views

Graham
 

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I suppose if you get the high power turbos, you can enjoy the 700-750bhp, then If you want another power hike, get some engine work done, and turn the boost up... somewhere along the journey, you might find the power sweet spot for yourself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·


eAndy, I was getting a good enough launch? 1.85 but only 11.4 trap, definitely need more power? lol. or mapping issue? boost running too low, its @ 1.3bar max when I can adjust on my toggle, used to be at 1.45 but Ben at GTC has been reducing every time I have a map tweak for some reason.

DODGY, interesting, but think I'll need the turbos, 5k in blowers is cheaper than an engine build, circa 20k?

Chronos, I'm thinking over buying turbos now will just be wasted money
 

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Only difference between our cars are the BOV's seems strange. As said my terminal speed is a good 6mph - 8mph higher.

I'll find some of my slips when home and take some photos.
 

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If you just want more power, then yeah, a set of reworked OEM turbos and higher flowing fuel pumps will get you there. Lots of choice out there, but I would take a look at EFR stuff as you can have your 750bhp and then if you get power hungry later you can build then engine and go for 900bhp. If you want cheaper option then Evotune (Jamie) is selling his SVM 950s.

If you want to reduce your quarter mile times, then get some R888s or get a set of wide 18s and some drag radials for the back. This will cut down your 60ft dramatically once your LC is tuned for them. I'm guessing your 60ft must be circa 1.9s going off your times.
These alone would get you straight in the 10s at your power now.

On a second look, your terminal seems quite low... any stage 4 guys chime in for comparison?
 

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ive got different rods and pistons but the cams/ports are stock. my turbos are stock housings just machined and gtx30 centres fitted, full 102mm exhaust and downpipes, big intercooler.

at 1.5 bar of boost on v power it makes 850hp and did 1/4 mile mph at 144.7 mph, time was 10.7 with a garbage 2.4 60ft I didn't use launch control

im sure svm or litchfields would do a deal on a basic rod and piston package and some turbo mods to keep stock manifolds and just increase flow to reach your power goals without fitting a full custom turbos and manifolds kit.


just keep the boost capped in the mid range to give the trans a chance, once your moving and blipping through the gears you wont even drop into the mid range anyway and will stay up in the 700+ hp power band constantly.
 

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If you just want more power, then yeah, a set of reworked OEM turbos and higher flowing fuel pumps will get you there.
reworked OEM turbos? tell us more :D

thanks
 

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The egines might well be good for 750bhp but they are capped by the Torque they can take on standard internals (around 630ft/lbs) so theoretically speaking by adding more bhp you're not going to go "quicker", you will just end up going faster.

You will need to do stage 1 engine works at the very least (around 4K I think) to be able to bump the torque upwards.

After you have done the internals you are looking at turbos, fuel pumps, FMIC etc so you are looking at another 7-10K

Once you've done that then you will start stretching the legs on the gearbox, depending on how far you go, so this will need addressing.

Acceleration aint cheap sadly and it's never just one thing to change :(


he will in theory be quicker and faster, remember the torque is capped in the mid range, the stock turbos will be dropping dramatically up top, once the bigger turbos are fitted the motor should then make and hold 630 lb/ft right to the limiter, and once you've hit max rpm as it shifts through the gears it will stay in the upper rpm range giving approx 100 hp, 100lbft more throughout the run.
 

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reworked OEM turbos? tell us more :D

thanks

I can show you more ;)





stock motor with just svm rod and piston package and stock turbos just reworked to svm stage 6 billet with gtx30 cores.
plot is on v power alone 1.4 bar raising to 1.6 bar up top.

with some e50 and 1.6 bar raising to 1.8 bar it makes an additional 116 hp ;)
 

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The hP isn't going to make the car quicker, the HP is going to make your car FASTER....... You need the torque to make you go quicker, you need to do the internals to allow for the increase in Torque!

If you put bigger turbos on and went for 750bhp with the same amount of torque you will theoreticallybe going no faster as you still have the same amount of force/power to shift the same amount of weight off the line... the fact the toque is capped indicates that the curretn setup can work harder if not for the internals!

Get the internals sorted and then release the cap on the torque with mapping and feel the difference!

I get your point with the turbos thoug Scoobyslayer with the car holding boost longer with the better turbos, just seems like a waste of the turbo if you then can't utilize them everywhere.
 

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I'm in the same boat as you mate wanting more power than stage 4 with DPs . But if I go to the next stage I will be changing at least the rods. Ideally I want about 750 hp and with the rods change about 700 ft lbs. just looking at my options for turbos to give me what I want with minimal lag
 

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Stealth69:- Not quite. You will increase BHP and torque (as they are relative) in the top end of the rev range where your engine will live once you are out of 1st gear on a 1/4mile strip. So it will make a difference.
 

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I think once you go beyond 700/750bhp. You have to/should change pistons/rods/clutch. It's a bit of a jump, but one worth taking!
 

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The hP isn't going to make the car quicker, the HP is going to make your car FASTER....... You need the torque to make you go quicker, you need to do the internals to allow for the increase in Torque!

If you put bigger turbos on and went for 750bhp with the same amount of torque you will theoreticallybe going no faster as you still have the same amount of force/power to shift the same amount of weight off the line... the fact the toque is capped indicates that the curretn setup can work harder if not for the internals!

Get the internals sorted and then release the cap on the torque with mapping and feel the difference!

I get your point with the turbos thoug Scoobyslayer with the car holding boost longer with the better turbos, just seems like a waste of the turbo if you then can't utilize them everywhere.

it will be quicker and faster, the torque will be more at 5000 - 7000 rpm where the motor will sit for the whole drag run from 2nd gear onwards, the torque capping is only in the mid range as the turbos fall on there face up top anyway and the torque drops off, look at my plot above it holds over 600 lbft right to the limiter, stock turbos will be under 500 lbft up top.

hp is just a measurement of torque and rpm and they will always interect at 5252 rpm, hp / 5252 x rpm will give you your hp figure ;) you cannot make one without the other

I make 630 lbft at 7000 rpm, divide that by 5252, then multiply that by rpm which is 7000 = 839 hp ;)



these engines need refraining through boost control the amount of torque they can make low down is immense and will break things, im on heat treated gear set with stops/ magnets and clips and am no doubt right on its limit on e50 and 1.8 bar, its plenty quick on v power so I havnt tried the e50 map at all yet.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
If you just want more power, then yeah, a set of reworked OEM turbos and higher flowing fuel pumps will get you there. Lots of choice out there, but I would take a look at EFR stuff as you can have your 750bhp and then if you get power hungry later you can build then engine and go for 900bhp. If you want cheaper option then Evotune (Jamie) is selling his SVM 950s.

If you want to reduce your quarter mile times, then get some R888s or get a set of wide 18s and some drag radials for the back. This will cut down your 60ft dramatically once your LC is tuned for them. I'm guessing your 60ft must be circa 1.9s going off your times.
These alone would get you straight in the 10s at your power now.

On a second look, your terminal seems quite low... any stage 4 guys chime in for comparison?
Yeah so I need to choose some turbos and pumps, I saw Jamies turbos and have wrote to him about them, can you just slap high power turbos on and have them turned down though? or will they be laggy? or just a waste on money as they arent being used properly..

Yeah my 60' times not that bad, I feel maybe I am down on power, I've sent a pic of my times for Ben to look at, he sent me a new map (with new lc settings he said) just before I went off to Santa Pod. and as I said, max boost is 1.3 bar, maybe turned down too low?

My other main question was how much is the OEM back half of the exhaust restricting, if at all?

Ta
 
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